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Do you think liars KNOW they're liars?

DianeO
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I have a sister, born in Feb. 1962.  She has that Aquarius stellium, Saturn, Mars, Merc. in early degrees and Jupiter Sun in later degrees, and in the 4th house.... the early Aquarius planets squared by Neptune in the first house and the later planets opposed by Uranus in the 10th.  She's embezzled felony amounts of money, convinced people to give her unbelievable things, and has been on full disability for a psychiatric disorder for 30 years, had a love affair with her meth dealer who she married.  She moved in with my mother 5 years ago and convinced her to make her executor, trustee, power of attorney of our family's large estate... then Mom died "suddenly" and it's been insane... the amount of lies told are staggering, and the only way to fight it is to a) hire a lawyer that will cost an insane amount of money or b) wait for Pluto ... her Nadir is 1 Aquarius, with Saturn at 4.  Then there's her Sun at 26 Aquarius, tightly opposing Uranus and transiting Uranus coming up to square that opposition.  Last but not least, transiting Neptune is in the dance of conjunction with progressed Mars, which is a reallly long transit and mimics her natal Neptune/Mars square.  When I went to see her and my other sister after mom died (I live very far away), they shunned me completely.  So what would you do?  I am inclined to let the planets do their thing.  She completely justifies her wrongdoing by saying "mom said I could" and "I took care of her in her last years, I deserve these things".  There's a will and trust, and none of it says "all for her and none for the rest".  I tried to tell her that Pluto is about to hit her 4 degree Aquarius Saturn on the nadir and that she needs to be incredibly honest but evidently she feels she has been.

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Rusalka
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They know. Unless they have hallucinations or delusions of grandeur à la bipolar 1, they know. Everyone else who lives like this always knows and I can't be convinced otherwise. She's lied to herself so much that she really believes it's ok.

I won't totally derail your post, but it's cathartic for me to speak freely about this, and I'm going to illustrate a point. My abuser's daughter has that Sun/Uranus opposition in Cancer and Capricorn, but with Neptune. She fires therapists, and lies and says they're in love with her, because they diagnosing her with personality disorders and she's so deep in her NPD that she won't accept it! She's a B-list musician who fucked her way to the top and then begged for help when her pics and videos got out. She can't play instruments and she's on a backing track live. When I outed her daddie dearest, her bassist, as a pervert she harassed, stalked, lied about, and gaslit me until I had nothing left. I was a threat to her fame because I could cancel her and daddy. I had to be crushed. Now you try to tell me she didn't know EXACTLY what she was doing. Your sister does too.

You're warm-blooded and you know what she's doing is intentional and wrong. You feel like you need to WIN and defeat your lying, conniving POS sister. I know this feeling well. I think it's okay to say you want revenge. My 8th and 12th houses are calling to let you know that you don't have to win to have some fun on their dime. Smile For example, Barbie is likely reading this because she stalks me and managed to intercept my device at least once. She's getting another reminder that her dad's - ahem - "idiosyncrasies" are going to wreck their careers, I warned her, and that's not a threat because I won't do anything - it'll be him. He probably tried to fuck your guitarist already, babe. You can't do anything about it except stop him!

See what I mean about squirming? Back to you and your liar. I'm not saying, "commit crimes and do evil." I am, however, saying it would really suck for her if she got neverending junk mail and spam calls and a lifetime supply of adult diapers sent to that big ol' house she thinks her crack ass is entitled to. And since your mom died suspiciously, even if nothing ultimately comes of it, do you think she's going to be able to keep calm if the police are alerted? Do you think she'll be able to keep those sweet, sweet disability bennies if she inherited a whole entire house and a bunch of valuables?! 

Unfortunately, I'm not a lawyer but if you want to play fair and by the rules, your options are probably: lawyer up, or let it all go and let the universe/God/karma have a laugh on her when they feel like cashing it in. That's not a concession. That's you choosing you, the worthier person. And I know it seems like an empty platitude, but I really don't think someone can get away with lying like this all the way to the end of life. You can't go through life screwing everyone because one day there will only be you left to screw. And if nothing else? Nobody can sue you for defamation once they're dead. So take good care of yourself and try not to get too wound up.

 

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Elsa
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 Elsa
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I'm sorry you're going through this. People are shocking.

I don't know that people necessarily know they're lying.  There are plenty of people who lie so frequently, they think they're breathing. It just doesn't register.

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soup
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Con artists. Charlatans. Fraudsters. Scoundrels. Full on quackadoodles. Imposters. Masqueraders. Cheats. No better than a Carny. 

My mother passed suddenly in October 22. I just watched as my sisters did what they could to turn the whole will and her wishes upside down. It was a circus. 

I watched for a month in horror while they tore each other to shreds thinking she left some large sum of money they could tap into. 

My mother ended up getting taken advantage of by a faux boyfriend, a Pisces. But either way... the Virgo sisters would have done it if he hadn't. I had to threaten to make factual YouTube channels about all of them to get her cremated as she had wished. She lay in a cooler for 30 days even though she had paid for her last wishes years prior. It literally took me threatening to tell the real stories on all of them to get her cremated.  

Liars. Sick... all of them. And yes. They knew they were lying. 

Diane if you know she is going against your mothers wishes step in. 

Transiting Pluto conjunct natal Saturn is going to serve consequences either way. 

 

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Rusalka
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Thanks @DianeO and @soup, for helping me get ready for my brother to pull this shit when my mom dies. I had a hunch but now I'm sure. Seriously, I'd rather know.

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soup
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@katyusha Nothing can ruin a family.... like family! 😳 

My mother planned and paid for her funeral arrangement's years in advance. All they needed was a phone call. They came and got her and started the process. Then... a bunch of people thought there was money to be had. Here they came. I mean they hadn't spoken to her in years. One, since 1998! She died in October 2022. I mean, I just sat back and observed. They all acted like animals. I know she was not the best mother, and I know they had reasons to depart and not speak to her.... but then why you coming back now? 

People show their ass when someone dies. 

What they didn't expect is that her faux boyfriend had a hunch it would happen and made sure the will was iron clad.... even still they could have sued, could have held her in that cooler for months until something was worked out through the courts. The funeral home told me while they know what her wishes were, in that state the sisters could hold them up in court. So, they waited. 

It made me sick. I had to call the ringleader and make the threat. It went like this.... number one, one of your kids have a different father than the one who has paid for said kid for all her life. Guess who is telling that story unless you allow mom to be buried immediately. She signed immediately after the message was sent. Other messages exactly like this followed. Unfortunately, I am the secret keeper. Secrets I will take to my grave.... unless you decide you are going to let my mother deteriorate in a cooler until there is nothing left of her after she paid for her own ending. I cop to it. I did it. And I do not care who knows it. 

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elisa
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If there's a will then she can't do anything really. As long as you're all there to collect what's yours.  So what if she took care of her the last five years? That's her choice. What's fair is fair, even if one sister or brother never shows their face for many decades. It's family and blood. I learned this with my son who was taken out of the will, when the will was supposed to be for his share but he was never there for that side of the family. They dont even know him. But the will was also for him. They took him out, not by the choice of the benefactor, his grandmother, on that side, but the other benefiiciaries/trustees.  They figured he's never around, they dont know him so why does he need the money?  That's just greed honestly. 

And also i have two elderly parents who i hope they plan to give equal shares, I have been taking care of them four months out of a year, and there's the other sisters who never show up, or show up once every other month. But who cares? I was upset at first because wow it's hard work and these gals need to step up, they are also their parents. But i also know my sisters can't handle it. They are dominant fire signs, and they will stress out and go mental. It's not something they can handle. not long term and i saw it first hand when they almost committed suicide being around my mother too. So, naw it's allright. They dont need to bother, they need their mental health and love from afar and support. I want them to have a good happy life. They are only good when they are doing well. When they are healthy and happy in life then they are of benefit to everyone around. And that's a huge happy plus for me too, because i dont want to stress about them too.

Gotta be compassionate and kind and understanding of everyone involved (especially loved ones) and WHO is involved because who is the one who can't handle who and I can't handle my elderly parents either, four months out of a year i'm going crazy sometimes and i can't wait to get out of there!! and get constantly abused too. I get slaps and abuse from my mother telling me to get out of her house when I tell her to bathe. And when hospice nurses witness her abuse to me, they prescribe her anti depressant. but I still love them and i have hired caregivers and now happily i have someone living there full time. I am still going to visit and stay few months out of a year though while caregivers are there and hospice. 

As for your sister, who is might be a pathological liar, which I've read online are really mentally ill. They have a mental disorder.  IF online sources for mental health are correct, then they do. I did take some psychology in college but not to the extent and in depth to have a degree in it. I"ve had an aunt who also was mentally ill, because of her gambling and it came from early childhood trauma. She just couldnt stop embezzling money. She brought ruin to her family and I know deep down she loved them with all her heart. But she was limited with her love because of her addictions and her trauma she could not go past. It's too deep and too much. 

All i can say since you asked for advise here, is I hope and pray everything will be allright because she's going to go through some harsh transits and it comes for everyone, innocent or not innocent. And sometimes it effects family, like a ripple of water spreading out.  Even the innocent are effected. I'm sorry to hear about her being like that. I'd just let her be, there's not much you can do. She's got that fixed stellium, that means she's super stubborn and nothing gonna change her. Let God, and let things be, and the lawyers will handle the Will.

If you do think she had something to do with the death, im sorry but, was there no one who was monitoring them on a weekly or daily basis there? Maybe nurses to find out her condition before her death and what caused and her illness? It's just that i understand how elderly care is, and someone always has to be there to monitor their health, and theres always more than several people so there's no big surprises.

edit, i'm not you, and i dont know your situation, but i have that cap/cancer, with family, so i think personally i'd try to find some compassion for her, maybe some pity. because it's very very sad, very tragic what's happening to her and to your family. take care.

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