I have known some liars in my time and one thing I can tell you about them is they lie.
Now I don’t consider myself savvy at all. In fact I have characterized myself as gullible many times on this blog but once I know a person to be a liar, that’s it. Once you have 2, 3, 4, 5 and more lies under your belt; once I have seen you lie to me and lie to others, you become what I call a “known liar”.
Once you are a known liar, everything you say is suspect. I may still talk to you if you are interesting enough but I don’t trust you word even you’re answering a question as simple as, “Is the sun shining outside?”
I figure whatever you say may or may not be the truth no matter how innocuous and if you’re a lying liar, you know this is smart of me because after all, you do lie.
What kills me is people who have people in their lives who have told them stacks of lies, epic lies, long-standing lies, hurtful, very egregious lies and then they tell then something else… something wild, and totally unbelievable, convenient etc. and they believe the thing. Not only do they believe it, it never even crosses their mind the person is lying!
We all know someone like this. Can you outline the astrology?
The liar I know has the South Node in Gemini and I was once told by an astrologer that people with South Node in Gemini need to work on being scrupulously honest. This person would lie about anything if they believed it would somehow benefit them.
I have the South Node in Gemini. Yesterday in a consult with Elsa, I was telling her of my woes with three women, and mentioned gee Elsa, maybe the problem is…I have you snowed. I am a pretty good storyteller, and I can stretch the truth when need be, and alot of the time no matter how hard I try, I cannot discern the truth, about myself or others. As usual, I am confused.
I have no clue the astrology, wish I did. What I know is that is drives me insane. Especially when they get mad that you don’t believe them later, HA!!!! This subjuct is just too touchy/hitting home right now. Love to hear what others have to say though,
Angie
I don’t know his Astrology, but I was married once to a compulsive lier. What used to really floor me was the many times he would lie to people about things that wouldn’t have mattered one whit if he had told the truth. Stupid stuff- it was almost like he couldn’t help it.
I used to say, “I didn’t believe half of what he said and doubted the other half.”
Retrograde Jupiter in bad aspect to mercury.
Twenty years ago after spinning me a yarn while he was dressing in the morning the Man (Leo S/ Aquarius M) suddenly stopped and said “You know sometimes I can’t believe the things I hear coming out of my mouth!” To which I remarked in my dry Capricorn fashion “Neither can I”!
Thirty years ago, when I first got heavily involved with the Actor (Aquarius S / Leo M), I told him there was no need ever to lie to me, since I never lay any shit on men, and that was the one thing I couldn’t stand. He told me “I’ve always lied to women – I don’t know why. But I’ll try very hard not to”. He did of course (and he’s been married four times now).
My husband’s Capricorn Moon never lied to me – but after we’d been together a few years his Aquarian Sun did; and it also prompted him to ‘fantasise’ to other people eg by embellishing his past. The Italian (Taurus with Aqua Moon) was too proud ever to lie but was sometimes economical with the truth (if only to spare me). And so on…
I realised when I was quite young that most men lie to women. I just took that on board and learned to deal with it: I think it’s a symptom of the relative emotional immaturity of men.
It’s also possibly a facet of the Aqua in almost all the mean I’ve been seriously involved with; I don’t know. Most of them have Leo too – and some Gemini.
I can’t talk about women: I don’t really have any close women friends who lie – what would be the point!? – so I don’t know the astrology of women I’ve known who lie. On the rare occasions it’s happened, usually early in a friendship, I’ve distanced myself – or amputated. I can deal with men lying, but not with women because I rely on them in a different way.
I think Mercury square Neptune is an indicator in an unevolved person.
Was in a relationship with a compulsive liar who, when I look back, practically announced that fact, as in “My so and so thinks I am a compulsive liar….”
Color me young and stupid. And lonely.
And he was, in the most pathological manner possible.
My ex-husband was a compulsive liar. He needed to be liked, so he pretend to be whatever the person he was interacting with wanted him to be. When we first met and started getting serious, he had me read a journal of “his”. I was impressed with his mental acuity and sensitivity – it made me swoon. Turns out said journal was actually written by a roommate he had a couple of years prior (I didn’t find this out until years later).
Then there was a lot of little stuff, when we were married, things that were no big deal, where “Oh, yeah. That was me. My bad, sorry” would have been appropriate.
Then there was the whole “by the way, I’ve been cheating on you for a year and piss drunk nearly every day at work, too!” thing….
Yeah. Long story short, I know someone very much like that.
the one i am thinking of is gemini sun with gemini rising. i’m not saying all gems are like this…but it seems to be a common theme. they are just damn good at it too. and there is also sun opposition neptune…i think this one has a lot to do with just lying to oneself and in the process everyone else.
I heard Gemini is responsible for this Mercury and neptune too.
I know a gem in mercury who has no problem lying and sometimes for no real reason. It’s understandable that someone would lie to avoid some serious consequence but other than that I just don’t get it.
What a waste of energy having to remember the lies and who he told them to..and the thing about liars, eventually people realize and spread the word. Then they have to move to another group of friends.
Ok this was my last boyfriend of two years. It wasn’t so much him outright lying but more lies of omission. I had to watch out for what he wasn’t saying. And of course, if I questioned something it became “you don’t trust me! And if you can’t trust, we can’t be in a relationship.”
Based on the thread above, it seems Gemini is a common theme. So let me add to it – he was a Gemini sun and venus :-).
But I would like to know if Elsa has seen any patterns in this regard.
“I think Mercury square Neptune is an indicator in an unevolved person”
Well, I have that square and I think I’m pretty ‘evolved’! And I’m no liar – quite the reverse.
Btw my friend who has ended up addled by coke and lying about it is a double Gemini. I do feel some of them are prone to self-deception – but it seems to be the doubles not the singles.
I’ve got Uranus in Gemini but I’m liable to believe everything I’m told simply because lying is so foreign to me!
The ones I’ve known like this have Moon in Gemini or Mars in Gemini or Gemini Rising. Sorry, Gemini! As an Aries, I do like Geminis, in general, but I try not to be such an innocent lamb as to get totally snowed by the liars who lie (and who also happen to have significant Gemini).
mine was a gemini.
he wasn’t even smart about it 🙁
(fyi i know a ton of geminis and only one certain compulsive liar. i know a scorpio that might be, also. but, if so, extraordinarily smart about it.)
What I’d like to know is — could there be aspects or sign placements that make someone appear as if they’re generally not a truthful person (without any evidence to that effect), when they actually are honest?
I guess I’ve been pretty fortunate in not knowing that many people who have been compulsive liars. My brother used to outright lie when we were kids in order to get me in trouble (no Gemini there — he was a Sag with Leo moon), and one of the men I dated omitted his history of cheating when he talked about his prior relationships (his friends told me the truth only after we’d split up).
Hmm I have known many like this Aries, Taurus, lots of Scorps and some Pisces, but I think the Pisces are in their alternate reality so I don’t know if that counts,lol. 😀
Yep I’m gonna go with gemini moons – they lie and its more of a compulsive thing with them, at least in my experience. It’s like having an itch you just need to scratch. Yeah, I tend to forget a liar is a liar after a while – I blame my sag naivety, but I’m learning!
I also have to call up on the gemini factor. Not every gemini lies…but statistically all the liers I can think of have significant gemini…and this is why I never had nor can i imagine having a relationship whith one 🙂
I’m Gemini with Mars in Gemini…I might embellish stories to make them more interesting but purposely hiding the truth, is something else..although white lies afe sometimes necessary…as a Gemini I can’t really make my mind up one way or the other so it seems 🙂
Well the “compulsive liar” in my life is my POS husband of 30 yrs – and those of you know my story from Chart#3 in the Colosseum. He has Mars in Gemini in the 7th house, Scorpio Asc and I believe his Libra Sun makes him indecisive on whether to tell the truth or not…all in all the truth or a lie is considered in how it makes him look good NOW! – and the older he has gotten the more lies he has to come up with to cover the others – and once people figure him out they amputate him, his mother, sisters, friends and family, and all he cares about is latching onto the next person no matter who that may be who will continue to believe him or stomach his BS till they take off – he will deal with the after effects with more lies and/or threats of intimidation (ie taking his toys away after throwing sand in your face in the sandbox if you threaten to tell….) yep he his a 52 y/o spoiled brat baby! There are strong Narcisstic traits and BPD in this person – God help him – he has dug himself quite a hole called his life of lies!! I started “seeing” the lies about 2 yrs into our marriage but i stayed focused on raising our children, but as they grew up – I noticed about 15 yrs ago his MO for lying…the shift in the eyes (Love that show “Lie to Me” – of course he hates it!) – and you can be right in front of his face 2 feet away and ask him a question and he will be looking right at you and say “HUH?” – that’s was it!! the big MO of him needing a few seconds to come up with a lie…and wow was he good with what he comes up with on the spot like that….If I ask something now, and he says “huh” – I just laugh and walk away don’t even repeat my question…he knows I’m on to him and his BS!!!
I always felt bad thinking such horrible things about my husband 15 years ago until we moved near his sisters and they affirmed my suspcions of his lying and never taking responsibility for the lies once found out either…
Sad Sad man, sad sad legacy (lies, alcoholism, drugs, adultery) to leave his children, sad sad marriage but I am Cancer Sun, Cappy Moon – guess i have alot of staying power, but he has no more control over me which is why he has a OW he lies too all the time now…just fine with me as long as he stays out my face (at least she is keeping him preoccupied while I get my affairs in order to cover my arse, till it is time for me to leave in one way or another, only the good Lord knows the plans He has for me, but I believe it is some great plans, cause out of these 30 years I can never regret my 4 wonderful children, they are THE best and only great thing (s) I have gotten from my LIAR of LIES!!…..:-D
I’d like to add: my Gemini moon friend who lies like a rug is also a good actor. I agree with the compulsive comment above — he can’t help himself. My Scorpio moon susses him out every time and sometimes I just laugh to myself when I see the tiny things he can’t even tell the truth about. I take him for what/who he is, and I think maybe he’s come into my life to help me dissolve the fanciful Moon conjunct Neptune fog I have had in my life. I’m not condoning lying by any means, just saying that if we choose to have certain people in our lives, accept them, and see how/why they may be there (or why you let them be there). I still keep this guy in my life because I get something positive out of the relationship, and maybe that is a Scorpio moon manipulation (or more Neptune fog!!!) But I’m under no illusions about this guy.
@reborninfaith, Ditto says it all! I totally get your almost ex yours and mine would start a club
Not to be repetitive.It just seems relevant to this topic.Has anyone visited the “Eyes For Lies” blog.This lady is a truth wizard. A lot of interesting commentary on crime cases,people in the pubic eye.For example She has recently posted her opinion on the Zahra Baker case.That precious little girl,who lost her life so tragically.She also analyzed the recent Larry King interview with Oksana grigorieva.She has a vast catalog in the archives.
Cancer BF with South Node in Gemini
I ve noticed traits of mercury as stated below in my readings and dealings with others…mercury ins scorpio..can struggle to divulge or hide’s things especially in aspect to say saturn..or mercury in pisces can be deceiving..but not in an intentional way…gemini..nuff said..but yeah mercury aspects would be the first place to look i would say
Sun Leo, Aquarius Moon, Scorpio rising. Mercury combust, conjunct Mars and the South Node. Grand air trine. The guy is brilliant, he’s a professor. I think Scorpio has the most to do with it. Anyway, I know how he is and he knows I know, and I catch him in fairly little stuff, so he is pretty straightforward with me. Wouldn’t trust him as far as I could throw him, but he is a lot of fun to be around. At this point in my life I’m cynical and just assume people are lying to me unless proven otherwise (Capricorn moon?).
I have the south node, Mercury, Venus and Ascendant, all conjunct in Gemini. There is no way I would have been able to get away with lying growing up, and as long as I did tell the truth, my parents wouldn’t punish me. There’s an easy way to live impeccably: just consider each choice and its impact on those around you, and ask inside for the wisdom to do the right thing. The road to fulfillment lies in creativity, mastery and the interaction with others can really be as simple as uplifting them gently.
Poor Geminis have a bad reputation, geez! I’m a triple Gem (sun, moon, asc, & venus too) with a stellium in Virgo to boot. I can’t lie to save my life! I giggle, like seriously, giggglllleee.
I can talk circles around a lot of people but to outright lie, I just can’t do. Maybe that’s my Saturn tho, needing to have integrity. He has quite an impact on my chart.
I’m noticing that the gemini’s that are saying they are not, and are not know as a liar type all seem to have the south node there. If the north node is considered to be characteristic of Jupiter and the south node is considered to be characteristic of saturn. Then I think it would definitely make sense that these south node gemini’s are not the ‘typical gemiliars’ we are usually talking about, they maybe have trouble making the whole ‘elastic truth’ thing work for them.
New question; do the saturn gemini’s out there find lying to be uncharacteristic of themselves like the south node gemini’s?
Like Virginia, I was raised in a home where lies were not tolerated. A lie found out meant a whipping from my father. I have four signs in Gemini, three square Pluto/Mars so I only lie to protect my privacy. I don’t embellish stories, hate gossip and am taciturn by nature. The only person I’m absolutely truthful to is my husband. He’s an Aquarius and honesty is very important to him so I’ve had to learn to be impeccable with my word. I know two women, one Sag with Moon and South Node in Gem, the other Cap with moon in Sag, South Node in Scorpio. Both are liars, serious liars, whose lies have resulted in them facing charges for lying in court.
I just threw up a chart for my first serious lover, a Leo with Moon in Scorpio! – for some weird reason this is the first time I’ve ever done it, so I didn’t know he was a Scorpio Moon – figures hahahaha!!!
He was a weird kind of liar – much more of a fantasist really: he fabricated great swathes of his life, in order to create myths and dramas around himself. He’s a poet and songwriter!
He has two extraordinary conjunctions which may partly explain why he’s like this – he’s got Sun and Pluto conjunct within .02 of a degree in Leo, with Mercury also conjunct within 3 degrees, and he’s got Uranus conjunct NN at 1.10 degrees in – yes – Gemini!
He also has Mars and Venus conjunct less than 2 degrees in Virgo, and Jupiter conjunct Chiron in Libra within 4 degrees… His Neptune trines his Mercury, Sun/Venus and his Moon… no other aspects
Wow… No wonder! He’s another man I’ve known intimately who really does live his chart. The strange thing is, I’ve intuitively understood these men without knowing their astrology, and forgiven them things others have utterly condemned – not so much from blindness but from acceptance. It’s such a trip, seeing it all in their charts at this point!
Aries — lies to make themselves look tougher than they really are.
Taurus — lies because they feel entitled to comfort even at another’s cost.
Gemini — lies because it’s so much fun to play with words.
Cancer — lies to protect their home and/or family.
Leo — lies because they want to look like the most important person ever, even if they’re not.
Virgo — lies because they think they’re right.
Libra — lies to avoid confrontation.
Scorpio — lies because they get a charge out of manipulating people.
Sagittarius — lies to get out of something they are responsible for.
Capricorn — lies to preserve their reputation.
Aquarius — lies because they don’t care enough about the person they’re lying to, when it comes to telling the truth.
Pisces — lies because they don’t know the truth when it hits them in the ass.
There are people from every sign who lie… not just Scorpio, or Gemini… and as many reasons for lies as there are liars.
Like George, I have Moon/Venus/South Node in Gemini, and I’m a lousy liar. I’ve been told that I’m too honest. Now that I think about it, I have lied about a couple of things in the past, out of embarrassment, and felt such guilt… I can’t live with myself if I lie. The truth always comes out anyway.
I don’t know what to say about someone who I know has lied to me. The truth finally came out about something, and the stories on certain things have changed here and there, but I’m still talking to them at times. My body knows when I’m hearing a lie; I’ll calm down briefly, but it will nag at me, and nag at me until the truth comes out. That’s how I got the big truth about something this Summer.
@danielle – your example hits this spot:
Am looking at a compulsive liar’s chart: Pisces Mercury tightly opposing retro Jupiter, retro Mars and widely opposing retro Neptune (all in virgo.) This Mercury can also ‘probe’ brilliantly as it trines Pluto…
It took me way too long and a lot of grief to see it for what it is. I came to the conclusion that in this case, this liar lies because plain reality is not acceptable.
Th astrology behind this probly has a lot in common with gaslighting.(Search board entries for more on that,)
I had a childhood, control-freak friend of mine who would lie to me about everything under the sun, trick, and manipulate. She is still the same as ever, at least a decade after. She said she was messed up and had problems before, so I gave her a chance, and see seems the same. I just cannot trust her to not attempt to use me when it’s evident she uses random people she meets all the time. :/
The astrology? She had Mercury the Trickster conjunct the Cancer Sun, Neptune opposing Mercury (deception), Mars and Venus in Leo (drama,entitlement), and a boatload of Pluto aspects (power). Just goes to show how energy is neutral until directed.
Hello, first time poster with limited astrology knowledge compared to what I see on this awesome board, so please be gentle. 🙂
Lots of Geminis I know are chronic exaggerators (embellishers of stories to make their already funny and interesting stories that MUCH MORE funny and interesting!) but I personally haven’t met one that tells the kind of lie that would hurt someone or be deemed unforgivable.
I have, however, had a few Exes with Libra placements that have been horrible liars. My last Ex has a Libra Rising and a Scorpio Moon and he couldn’t tell the truth if you paid him a million dollars to never tell a lie again. He also has his Sun/Venus in the 12th…secrets/hidden life galore.
PS I love this site! 🙂
@Sharon.”Libra lies to avoid confrontation”That has been my experience w/ my Libra Sun conjunct Mercury person.Good job My Scorpio/Pluto can see rite through that b.s.!
@Sharon very nice list! and great conclusion too!
thanks for the laughs 🙂