QUESTION
note to self… must keep short!!
do you believe curses / hammering bad luck/ too much life lessons in a chart,
or let people know they have them [even in different terminology]
what are some of the aspects you think people will feel as such
and
how do you encourage them to keep on hammering on [their head on the wall]..
particularly these days, when for us older mid to older folk who use to think there
was a purpose to all these hahahaha shenanigans
‘lunairy’
Hi, lunairy. This is a question and a half, at least.
I do believe in curses, and hammering bad luck, but I do not believe in “too much life lessons”. More than your share of lessons? Certainly. But the gifts and talent you need to deal with them are always provided. Sometimes, you have to learn from another person. I’m sorry if I pick up your writing patterns here, it’s not intentional. It’s Neptune. Let you give you an example of what I mean.
I did not know the heavy pot on my nightstand was a weapon, until my husband (a soldier), explained it to me. He went through the house, identifying potential weapons in every room and explaining the best way to use them.
Prior to this lesson, had there been an intruder, I’d have behaved like a typical “girl”. Scream, hide, cry, etc. If you break into my house today, you’ll be sorry. I’m suggesting you have a chart full of tools and remedies, you don’t recognize.
“how do you encourage them to keep on hammering on [their head on the wall]..”
I don’t encourage this. I immediately tell them, what they are doing is not working and we’re going to find something that will. It’s always there, by the way. And I do let people know exactly what is dogging them.
“particularly these days, when for us older mid to older folk who use to think there
was a purpose to all these hahahaha shenanigans”
When you think something is true, for a long time, you can’t imagine it’s not true. But if you’ve got what astrologer, James Braha, called, “a mistake of your intellect”, your believing it, even over years or decades or a lifetime, does not make it true and will never make it true. It will just have you live your life as if it were true, which is entirely different. I used to think I had no weapons in my house, see?
I think you’re stating here, there is no purpose to your life. That’s one perspective but how many people do you think would agree with you?
Not me.
This is related:
No, I think the question posed is “Do you tell a person they have a tough (or heavy, or unfortunate) chart where negative aspects outnumber the good ones?” And, if you do tell them that they are fated to have more struggles and less of the good life, how do you tell them? I was once told that “There is no Santa Claus in your chart to jolly things along,” but I had figured that out by then (in my 20s).
I’m sorry. I thought I answered that. YES. I tell them what I see and I don’t mince words.
Yes, you did!
thats a good line about ‘…Santa Claus not jollying you along.’ Realism at its finesT 😉
i’ve struggled with how to express to my now just adulting children 17/21/22 the realities of life journey while still trying to not being a downer. my usual motivating tone seems stupid now.
Moon-Saturn, Sun-Saturn -conjunct, square, opposition. Throw in Chiron or Pluto. Especially when young, no way to handle Saturn. It can be very destructive.
🙌🙏🫂
thanks eLsa.
the irony here is ive been known as the stoic one & polyanna o_O [had to look it up years ago].
but i really have felt pollyanna left the building some time ago..
& im pretty sure she ain’t comin back..
& thinking ahead of the aries & masculine energy to come pretty much probably confirms this..
but
my concern is i use to be the inspiring one, now i truly have no answers for anyone.. i can’t point to or back up any reasoning for bothering with making effort to be or do better… the end goal has like its disapperaed literally like a mirage 🧐🤔
This sounds like Saturn in Pisces to me. Unending misery… not real, unless you believe it.
i was actually just driving home earlier & had this ExacT thought just pop into my head from nowhere…
& again ironic that i was the preacher of ‘This Too shaLL paSS’ for decades, by the time i went to get it tattoeed its trendY… so nope 🙅♀️
we shaLL see if it does indeed pass… 😉
If you can accept everything about how you are at the moment with no pressure on yourself to change, no comparison with another time or another way of being you, it will move through quicker.
ooooh thaTs very ZeN… i pottered with buddhism & Taoism for a good while, which was similar style of thought /or noT thought 🙂
i found it tricky parenting & in crisis dangerous times fell out of it a bit
It’s a way to deal with Saturn when it’s pressurising your ego to release control. The suffering is the resistance of the ego to let go. You can more consciously support the letting go process by the means I described. You are not alone in going through this process.
This is great advice, thank you! Having a power struggle with my ego right now.
yes. i dont mind saTurn. he is my reliable keep me in checK.
he always wins anyway.
& i feel he does have this strange push pull of Do The Work, WHILE letting go of the need to control.. mixed messages mindfkery at times.. [though it could be not his fault, consisering the squaring chiron & mars/sun..]
i like him, 🪐its my only stability i/ve had in my life.. he keeps me on track 🙅♀️ bit like a really solid good father/elder relationship.
I usually envy other people’s charts as mine is a landmine field with Sun conjunct Pluto and Mars square Saturn and a loaded 12th house so I tend to be positive with other’s charts. I’ve learned that the dread Mars square Saturn is a relative saving grace that gives me the persistence to plow through the challenges (thanks to a reading with Elsa!) and I’ve learned through that reading that there is usually an angle out of even the difficult aspects in a natal chart.
12H 🙏💕
ive known some 12H’s but i still havent mastered the understanding of it fully yet.
thats one aspect that very much keeps me from assuming i know how to help or support people astrologically.
the closest 12H’r i have is my eldest son with Pluto there.. that was some heavy sh1T time for him as a youngen, but the adults ive known have been brief & i never really did grasp it.
I’ve pondered my lack of understanding may be because my energy is all down on my IC.. & pluto in 3H .. so am processing it more???, is 12H not a processing of stuff?.?
im not sure? but as i said its an aspect i dont like assuming anything about it.
sorry for the ramble, was just pondering out loud 🤔🤭
I understand this. I have a 12th house myself, as well as the recent transits. Someone formulate a question and I will cover this.
oh. i wondered that eLsa. if you were a 12H’r.
is it less of processing to workout & fix, & moreso just guts to KeeP on doing… is it general to brutal melancholy??? hmm.. i hope other 12H ers speak-up… i would love to learn
I also have Mars square Saturn, and Saturn squares Chiron while Mars opposes it. Rather hard to work positively with those aspects.
as a fellow ‘YeP all that’ 🫂
some things just feel like you’re in the centre of a ring with punches kicks coming at you from all angles, no matter where you turn, without a break.
you get back up, over & over for more.
it can get exhausting to keep trying to focus on a positive for sure 🙌
I think Saturn was conjunct my son when I was between 2 to 3 years. Hard to get a hard transit in the early years because you can’t remember what was going but would have left its mark anyway.
Elsa, if you were to summarise the 12th house and how it affects those with natal planets placed there, what would you say?
It depends on which planet(s). Aspects count. A planet conjunct the ascendant is different than on deeper in the 12th.
Well I have Mars in Leo in the 12th conjunct Leo Asc – so technically in the first. My dad (Cancerian, 21 July so on the cusp) was loving but moody and for many years his drink and gambling caused havoc in the family. His sister lived with us and I always thought his side of the family were eccentric and odd and 5 out of the six kids (me included) were odd balls too. I always battled with the shame of feeling this way. My brothers are also “interesting’ and my mother’s father had a lot of issues from what I heard. (All my grandparents had passed away before I was born) My children’s father was hard work. I find women easier to get along with. My daughter has saturn in Pisces in the 12th and I split with my ex when she was five. Her saturn is conjunct my sun. My son has moon in the 12th in Capricorn and our relationship was fractured at an early age due to my immaturity and treating him like a scapegoat. His sun is conjunct my Pluto too. It’s interesting how the sign and house that the moon is in shows how the child perceives the mother. Very accurate for my four anyway.
Update to include this related post:
https://elsaelsa.com/astrology/what-if-my-chart-my-life-is-horrible/
I wonder, what would make a chart be called “cursed” or “horrible”, this is vast for sure.
I assume it would be something with not only harsh event, but maybe also recurrence or prolonged, and above probably an absence in the chart of ‘balsamic’ or ‘heroic’ energies (a optimist mind, a trusting heart, etc.). Also, I assume, a chart with an affliction of pain in how you see and feel things.
Just trying to narrow it down – would I be looking at afflicted moon and sun? At harsh aspected Saturn and Pluto ? I mean my own chart is not a blossom, but the idea of calling a chart cursed just dreads me (although at some point I did think this about myself). Thank you!
I don’t think it is one thing. It’s a preponderance of things.
correcT.
i second thiS.
my favourite saying & most recent taTToo.
#CONTEXTisEVERYthing
Thank you to both for the replies.
its the ratio miX in the pot.
there can be lots of usefuL ingredients in the poT, but one off point measurement can fk the whole dish by bouncing wrong in all directions which then bounce against somethin else….
🫣a non thought out analogy, but it makes sorta sense 🤔
oh & the longevity of some over others… im now getting the vision of something off in the fridge transfers & messes E v e r y Thing – short & longterm 😉