I had a situation come up with one of my friends. She was in a circumstance where it seemed someone she knew and liked was up to no good. The evidence was extremely incriminating. 9 out of 10 people would vote to convict, I’d say which makes it very hard to be the one standing alone to defend. Might you be a fool?
Being as I am her friend I argued for about a half hour, the 90% side of this, against her faith. This may sound cruel but it was requested because if she were in denial about this thing it would come down on her pretty hard when the veil lifted so I probed and prodded every nook I could find while she continued to stand up for the guy. Finally, I became convinced.
“Okay, I am voting with you now. You must be right because if something was wrong here you’d have caved. But I just outlined every possible bad scenarios and one after another you told me they did not jibe with your feelings.”
“They don’t.”
“Okay, well it sounds like you know this guy and you know what you know. And you ought to just go with it because it seems to me you could hear something about someone and just know for a fact that it is outside their character… it’s just not something they would do.”
“Yeah, I think that.”
“Me too. There are some things you can’t be wrong about ant it sounds like this one of them. I mean what if someone came to you and said I did something and there were all kinds of evidence but you just knew it was something I’d never do. Could that happen?”
“That could happen.”
“Yeah, I think that could happen too. So maybe you’d say no. She didn’t do that. That doesn’t sound like Elsa, it is outside the bounds of what I know to be her character. I think this is like this with this guy.”
“I think so too.”
“Okay then. I agree with you against all the evidence though I would not feel that way had I not grilled you so much. We had to do that but we did and you stood up to it completely. If there was something to come out I think it would of. I say blah, blah, blah and you start to see things that corroborate it. Oh yeah this and that, you’d say and the picture would emerge. But that never happened and I think this is definitive. I think you are right about this guy regardless of how unlikely it looks on paper and I don’t think you have to think about this anymore.”
She sighed her relief. “Oh, good. I feel so much better.”
“I bet. Nothing like having your faith win.”
Later that evening her faith was confirmed but it left me to wonder. What about those people who go off in some way and all the neighbors say they just can’t believe it. They never expected so and so shoot up McDonald’s or whatever. How does that happen?
I don’t think it would happen to me but this is because I think everyone on this planet is capable of going off given the right set of circumstances. But stealing a loaf of bread? There are some people who are just simply not going to do that under any circumstances.
Do you trust the things you know? How strong is your faith and where is Jupiter in your chart?
All this faith stuff is really interesting to me.
I had all these reasons to drop a belief I had that something would happen, and yet it didn’t sit right in my gut. Yet I knew very well that I so badly wanted it to happen, that it was a case of trying to seperate my intuition from my wishfulness. It is hard but I am trying to accept now that I was wrong and it won’t happen.
I have an eighth house Jupiter but I don’t see how it connects for me.
Jupiter cnj Saturn in the ninth. I do trust the things I *know* and I have loads of faith, and it has been be my blind spot. I tend to believe the best of people regardless and then be kinda gobsmacked when I turn out to be deluded. So I kinda take a ‘You can believe what you like, but this is what I think about this’ stance.
Nevertheless I’m happier believing in the best. I grew up in an environment where it was sorta assumed people were waiting to screw you over and I’d sooner be deluded in this direction than in that one.
once i figure out what’s worth having faith in. i tend to be pretty skeptical about placing too much faith in anything (i guess that’s the gemini jupiter?) but some things stand up no matter what doubts i throw against them. everything else i can’t take too seriously.
though it was really really hard to go through the pluto transit conjunct my neptune (in sag.) broke down a lot of my bedrock faiths, but the things that survived that… give me an amazing amount of grounding. this was shortly after the pluto transited opposite my jupiter, also challenging, but extremely rewarding- that was more about collapse and reconstruction of belief _systems_ than of the _process_ of belief, which i experienced through pluto’s conjunction with neptune.
Jupiter square Saturn. Vacillate between trusting my instincts and being innately hopeful (Moon/Jupiter conjunct)and doubting everything (Saturn). It can be a rough ride.
Jupiter/Chiron in Aries(11th) opposite Mercury/ Pluto in Libra(5th). I have a hard time trusting the strong intuitions that Mercury/Pluto (trine Moon) gives me.
I have Jupiter Opposition Neptune, and when I trust in people, bad things have a tendency to happen.
I also have Jupiter in Gemini. I have the best luck when I trust in the facts (or the truth, which isn’t quite the same thing as the facts, but tends to be closely related).
Faith does very little for me. I really admire it as a concept, it’s just sort of like a piano… and I’m someone who can’t play the piano. 😉
I don’t know… I think humans are capable of just about anything, no matter how upstanding they are or have been in the past. And consistently mean people can surprise you with sudden acts of compassion.
Case in point: A friend (not a close one, but I knew him well enough) was the sweetest guy you could ever hope to know. Just a teddy bear. He’s in the slammer now for molesting his own kids. I read over the evidence and the conviction details, and you know, there was no reasonable doubt. He did it. Broke my heart plumb in two.
My Jupiter is in Cancer in the 4th. Don’t know how that translates into trust, though. I watch, and if they’re good people over time, I give them the benefit of the doubt. But I know that people have a dark side that can come out in the weirdest, most twisted ways when the conditions are right.
Jupiter in Aires, which indicates self employment or so I’ve been told, which is true. Oppose Saturn, square Uranus, does that mean anything to anyone? I think I have been projecting goodness onto other people that isn’t always there, there’s so much Libra in my chart. Yet sometimes, I feel it plays out, like, if I see only a higher spirit in someone else, even if I know they’ve done evil things, I can see a light shine forth, like they come in touch with their higher self, even if only temporarily. Can people change? I don’t know, but I think everyone is at least capable of coming more in touch with pure Spirit.
Yes I do trust the things I know. I actually am incapable of lying to myself, so it translates this way. I’m willing (and quite intrigued) to have my ideas tweaked and challenged, so I’ve been known to frustrate a few rigid thinkers in my time.
Life changes and beliefs change too, and I have complete faith that if my beliefs are challenged it is because they are destined to (Pluto in the 9th–I like to transform my thinking). My Neptune/Pluto conjunction in 2002 was like hell on earth, but I wouldn’t trade it for the world.
Kshmiri, elegantly put. Oh My God, I am, like, so jealous!, tell me your sign ha ha. I am so rigid in my frustration with current events and have been for 8 years, and many more. And my ego is validated by most of today’s advanced thinkers and spiritual leaders…how do I let go of my resentment, and anger and sadness over innocent people being killed?
My faith can be strong but I doubt all the time anyway. I just had a few transits in the last few years that had me doubting everything. But now Saturn is helping to ground and I’m kind of thankful. It’s helping me regain my footing and putting my faith back in perspective. I’ve finally taken up a meditation practice in yoga and I feel it’s helping me see into the confusing energy of my 12th house planets and my neptune/jupiter square.
I have jupiter in pisces and neptune in sagittarius, as well as libra planets in the 12th and saturn in the 9th. I’m all about faith, ideals, expansion and deception.
Mari there is a great blog I read, it’s ravinguniverse.blogspot.com. Jm writes it, an artist and musician with an incredible take on world events. You may find it really interesting.
As for letting go of resentment and anger about people being killed…that is a really big question my friend. I would highly recommend a reading with Elsa, so someone can explain the astrology bit (knowing what’s happening with your chart really helps).
If paying attention to current events are damaging your spirit I would suggest doing a Timothy Leary without the LCD and tuning out. Start with yourself.
Love.
Do what you can. And try not to worry if it is ‘enough.’ Frankly, no,it is never enough, so perhaps try not to think about that question.
As for validating the ego, the ego is never validated. It’s a bottomless pit.
And keep coming here…there are so many great, kind people here who inspire me every day!
Jupiter in Aries (12th house) trine Sag Sun – huge faith when young. But people’s crap have tempered that over the years. I was down and out and a loner for many years – yet I had an internal faith that things would get better for me. And finally they did. Am pretty good at discerning people these days…but my ex would always suck me in then betray me. Not any more. Good to wise up!
kashmiri- your comments are incredible and certainly resonate with me.
life changes and beliefs change too!
so even if you are willing to have your ideas tweaked and challenged, i cannot do this for you today. at least not intentionally.
i have a very strong faith that everything will work out for the best to the point that I believe that gaia will handle anything the human race can throw at it. i also believe in john lennon’s instant karma.
jupiter in sagittarius conjunct midheaven.
this faith has changed from a youthful naivety to a trust in allah but tether your camel kind of philosophy. eternally optimistic grounded in in the here and now realism.
i am less anal. more tolerant of others. you know. walk a mile in their shoes before you would judge them.
this may have to do more with uranus in leo. sorry. bad joke. but what i mean is that of course life changes and beliefs change. it’s about maturing as we grow older.
your advice about doing a timothy leary without the acid is profound. i could not survive day to day without tuning out. I only have so much capacity for all the evil, corruption and tragedy in the world. and while i acknowledge that it is there and i peak at it from time to time and do my small part whenever i can to make things right, i remember these words from desiderata.
with all it’s sham and drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. be cheerful. strive to be happy.
Randamandar- you are lovely. Thank you. I’m with you!
Kashmiri, thanks, yes, the Raging Universe is at the top of my Favorites, also, along those same lines, I’m big on http://astrotabletalk.blogspot.com/ . Dharmaruchi did a brilliant reading of Barach Obama this past week, it’s worth checking out.
Interesting, just reading another chapter in Deepak Chopra’s Book of Secrets, and guess what the title is? “Evil is not you enemy” Because it is not “out there”, as Everyone has evil shadows within, that must be confronted and allowed to flow, or that might come forth under the right circumstances, as experiments have shown. (You know, how students became monsters when playing at being prisoner guards) I’m not doing him justice here, but it’s similar to the old argrument about Duality, which does not really exist, except as an extension of the Ego, if you believe all of the Masters.
Timothy Leary, ha ha. Tune out, absolutely, it’s a discipline, harder without the acid, but I try more and more, at least, to be the “witness” to my thoughts, even if I can’t keep them from coming. Because it’s thoughts that start the ball rolling on what feelings will come, what will be the quality of your reality. I have been experimenting with that and believe it to be true. Just for example, I can do this little mediation about money flowing in, and I can predict the faucet turning on, and get jammed with jobs. Than I can slow it down. So trying to work more on more of a “passive” quality of income, ha ha.
Have a beautiful weekend, y’all! I get to work on deadlines ugh, I’d Much rather tune out..
I remember reading this when it was first posted and I didn’t really have anything to say. I don’t have much faith, I don’t believe in much. I trust what I know and I generally trust my instincts and that’s as far as I’m willing to go. Everything else is a big unknowable, untrustable.
Through all this shit with my ex, I had faith and trusted that he was still the person I knew and loved. However after months and months of going it alone and trusting in myself and what I thought I knew, I faltered. I just accepted that everyone else was right, I was wrong and had always been. So now I’m in the process of rebuilding something. I’m not sure what it’ll be when it’s done.
Jupiter rising conj asc in Cancer, sextile N. Node, trine MC.
Hi SaDiablo I am sorry that you have had to go through ‘all this shit.’ I hope that everything goes well for you and the process of rebuilding something provides you with inspiration and happiness.
Thanks, rand. Things are looking up, mostly, and having you guys here at the blog helps me a lot. A lot, a lot, a lot.