Have you ever wished you could talk to your dead, older-than-you, relative? I often wish I could talk to my grandfather, Henry. I have so many questions! He taught us a lot when we were children but you know. PUBERTY! We all took off, leaving the riches behind. It’s too late now.
I came across what I thought was a radical statement until I realized it was inordinately accurate. Not necessarily for one hundred percent of the people, one hundred percent of the time but still, I feel this is broadly true.
There comes a point where an older person might know you are utterly wrong about what you’re saying and they’re not going to tell you. It’s easy to see why. Henry told me not to smoke? Did I listen? No. He told me not to gobble sugar, eat bad food or whatever. Did I listen to that? No! Instead, I got some fries and dipped them in gravy, at two in the morning, out with some Italians I knew!
Now I’m the old person and yes. If you ask me directly, I will tell you in most cases, but otherwise? I will keep my mouth shut in most any case – why? Generally, because you won’t believe me, or you don’t value my opinion anyway. You think I’m out of touch? You’re not going to listen, I’m a moron..
It’s all the reasons of that ilk but here’s the problem and the reason for this post: because of this phenomena, real history, real knowledge of what a person has learned, firsthand, is rarely shared. Think how much power that puts in the hands of people who wish to exploit you. It’s astonishing.
I’d like to say, the silence of the older people makes them complicit, but I’m not sure it’s true. If you say something fifty times and no one listens to you, with the fifty-first time do the trick? I think it’s more likely it be the straw that breaks the camel’s back. You’re now disinvited.
This leaves old people to sit in silence as younger people get it wrong. Tricked in the same way they were.
I don’t know how to solve this or if it’s even possible. I’d ask, Henry, if I could.
Do you ever consult someone older than you, for this reason: they’re older than you?
The thing is..because we are all living our life the 1st time there’s no judgement if we get it wrong. And so we all want to make mistakes and learn from them. Maybe nobody wants enough to get it right? Somebody else’s advice, even if they’re older is just not good enough because that’s from outside, it’s not your own thing. We feel compelled to do our own thing even if it’s bad so that we can get it wrong to then get it right. Nobody trusts others more than they trust themselves.
I was this way with my grandfather, but I routinely tapped older people for advice, when I was young.
I still ask, people for advice, constantly. Daily, even. Might be Libra ♎,
There have been a few of these threads over the last twenty years, People say they want to make their own mistakes.
My angle this time, is to state, if you are relying on people to speak up, it seems they won’t. I don’t think it was this extreme, when I was young.
Oh I can relate because I’m exactly the same. Libra Asc btw. But I’m thinking maybe I only ask to hear the advice. It’s one thing to hear and another to follow it. Actually I never follow it, there’s probably some wisdom in people who do.
Man, now I want some french fries! I do listen to older people more so than people closer to my own age. I have Saturn opposite Venus, maybe that is why? I never take anyone’s word for anything though, I’m inclined to do my own research. Maybe older people are also quieter because the more you see and experience, the more you realize how much you don’t know. I could see opinions becoming less important the closer you get to the end of life.
Thanks. That makes a lot of sense. I quit offering my unsolicited opinion about twenty years ago, for that reason. if it mattered, the person would ask.
I have older friends (also younger) and view their experiences as very valuable. But I always valued my grandfather and great aunt’s experiences and advice so it just continued with other people after they died.
From time to time I’ve met many older people who are not particularly wise and often (not always) the common threads (in my experience but I know it’s not necessarily the norm) were complete lack of self awareness, repeating negative self-sabotaging behaviours or self-beliefs, and not having diverse life/cultural experiences (keeping mostly in a comfort zone.)
Older people with the last two aspects mentioned above still have some good wisdom to impart/share.
I have Sun trine Saturn, Saturn square Jupiter, and Saturn trining my Ascendant by sign.
If you know that someone’s mind is completely closed on a subject, my philosophy is that one piece of advice is the limit..A common occurrence for me during the great “pandemic” scam…
I’ve learned that my children needed to make their own decisions and learn from their own mistakes, just like me.
That doesn’t mean I didn’t tell them that they are wrong or doing no good, but I didn’t threaten them or use emotional blackmail.
As I was raised by old people, I learned something: Instead dishing out judgment or getting angry, they just asked me simple questions, like what is that thing you want to do or have giving you? Will you be happy if you do it? Have it? They stayed kind and curious, no need for me to be defensive or stop listening. And they told me about their own life, and mistakes, and dangerous situations and how grateful they are to still be alive.
That made me curious to know them as people who are probably wiser than me. We argued but without aggression.
They were genuinely caring for my wellbeing even if I dismissed their arguments.
Especially one aunt of mine, I loved her and I remember distinctly that I decided at around age 12 that I want to be like her when I’m old. I’m getting there….
A very sensible approach..We mustn’t take agency away from our kids, but on the other hand we must have rules in our house and communities..But everything has to be within an atmosphere of love..
It depends on the person. Age does not necessarily bring wisdom…some people learn and change–many dont and ‘misery loves company’ ie if we can bring others along on ‘our ride’ we are confirmed in our views. This is how herd mentality works.
Eg A lot of young Gens seem to have really bad diets,l am not dumping. l am just worried about you all. High additives.Presevatives.Vegan diets too are not always healthy. (l am not talking pure vege here).High salt and sugar is Bad for mental health and general health. l like chips too, Sirena O. (l have Venus opps Sat and do my own research like you) and l love ice-cream…but only some times, so it doesnt become ‘forbidden’ and more desireable.
I am particularly interested in new thinking and the opinions of gens younger than me atm…l listen. But opinion is one thing…truth another. That one is thorny. Truth. What makes something true? Facts, yes. Balanced argument(provable evidence)…personal exp. perhaps.
l remember making a deal with my nephew who was 20ish, at the time, we were having a heated argument…l didnt want to cut him off, so l gave him a book on how to argue a point. It was not about telling him: what to think, but how to discriminate, weigh and balance evidence. He is a Gemini and he took it on…we still don’t agree on many things-so what. The conversation will continue…l hope.
wonderful! I think you make alot of good points
😂 lol yes. I’ve consulted with you before!! !
I like your comment so much, your nephew is very lucky to have you in his life! People who leave room for differences, an open door for talking, listening to others but filtering it for themselves internally And give me a book to read, I am sold! 😁
@Dianne’s comment.
I have always loved hearing the thoughts and stories of those older and more experienced than me. It didn’t mean I would always take the advice, but I am definitely open to hearing it because we don’t know what we don’t know. A different perspective can open up new worlds we never knew existed.
sure there are times older people would tell me things. I never thought they were doolally but I argued their point.
I wouldnt walk away thinking they were morons. I just felt they were a bit out of touch. My dad was a visionary of sorts and I still remember all the wisdom he taught me and I still follow… or at least keep in the back of my mind like a little voice. My Scorpio mother had an extensive older generation so I knew my great grandmother and great aunts so I was surrounded by elders all the time. I worked in nursing homes and would hang out a lot when I was single with my mom and her friends.
why?
I’m thinking maybe Virgo,Uranus Sun ìn 12th. Moon in 8th. Aquarius Saturn in 5th. So not fully a child in the first place I guess
I learnt in my late 30s that you can learn to play at any age, Hildegard N.–if you can find the right playmate(s). I am not being flippant…’play is childrens’ work’…thinking of that 6th house Picses too…
On another note, because you reminded me, and because St Hildegard Von Bigen is a fav. of mine. l ‘found’ in an Op Shop (Thrift store) a copy of ‘Feather on the breath of God’Gothic Voices with Emily Kirby. 1982. (composed by Hildegard). It ia so beautiful l wept. Just glorious this recording. Play it for your oldies. A friend of mine with more Virgo than you does a similar job–she has organised a local kindergarden to come to visit her Oldies–they ALL play!Everyone looks after one another.Love it.
I have more Virgo than mentioned. I just listed what may be applicable to the situation.
I was born on St Hildegard’s feast day and I’m a herbalist and so that’s where my handle comes from.
I wear her saints medal. Her music is moving. There is a farm in Maine called Blessed Herb Farm you might want to Google.
It’s nice to hear someone knows about her.
A Saturn in the 5th house is I was most thinking about.