Unknown Birth Times And Casting A Natal Chart

Ayn RandI read about a new movie opening last night based on Ayn Rand’s novel Atlas Shrugged. I haven’t read any Ayn Rand but I’m somewhat familiar with her general philosophies. There are two reasons I haven’t read her work, one, that I’m a pleasure reader and it doesn’t appeal to me, and two, I’m a Pisces and try to avoid things I see as cultish for fear of subconscious indoctrination.

I wanted to take a look at her chart and the two sources that had posted her chart had a birth time of 3:30pm. She was born in 1905 in St. Petersburg, Russia, and I thought, “Really? You have a birth time?” Poring over the fine print I realized they didn’t. I suspect that birth time was picked to give her a Leo rising and an Aries MC. What actually made me question the accuracy was the placement of a 7th house Sun. To my way of thinking, no, no way did she have a 7th house Sun. To me, Sun house placement would be more a focus in setting a birth time. But that’s me.

Some people like setting the birth time at noon when it’s unknown. That way you hit the middle and any aspects to the moon are likely to be within orb. I like to set it at midnight on the morning of the day. That way I can see the whole range of possibilities. Again, that’s just my way. I don’t see it as more valid that any other way.

I don’t try to seriously rectify charts (attempt to pinpoint a birth time) as I think there are just too many variables to account for. However, one thing I try to keep in mind when looking at charts of public figures is that there’s no way of knowing for sure if they have the correct birth time. Because of this I prefer to look only at the aspects between the planets, which is irksome as I really like seeing house placements.

What is your view when looking at a chart without a birth time? How certain are you of your own birth time?

16 thoughts on “Unknown Birth Times And Casting A Natal Chart”

  1. On topic: if no birthtime, I’m a noontime user, using instinct and if I have knowledge of the individual to fiddle further. I rarely mess with celebrity birth charts. Generally just getting a feel for the chart and the aspects is good enough for me. But I’m a dilettante like that.

    I’m very certain of my birthtime. I have my “certificate of live birth” and the time noted is specific, not rounded off to a :00 or a :05. I figure there might be a minute’s difference one way or the other, clocks being what they are, but I don’t sweat it.

    Off topic: ROFLMAO. I love that quote. I offer:

    *ducks, runs*

  2. I’m 80% confident in my birth time and fretted about it for a few days, but finally decided that it wasn’t worth the ulcer. I don’t have my husband’s birth time (and both his parents and most of his family are now passed). I have played around with different times (other than Noon), but hadn’t thought of 12AM- great idea – off to astro.com

    Thanks Satori!

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    I set it for noon, to have at least some idea of the Moon.

    OMG I seriously laughed at the quote… “The other, of course, involves orcs.” Brilliant!

  4. I’m somewhat certain. I have two relatives who think i’m pisces rising. It changes my mc to the 9th house, and pulls pluto closer to my descendant, which seems to fit. Who knows, i’ll have to observe, reflect on the past…..time consuming, and i’m not at all motivated to even peek right now.

  5. My birthtime appears on my birth certificate. It is probably 95% accurate so no worries.

    for my boyfriend? Another story. His birthtime is unknown. I’ve been working on rectifying it and guessing his rising sign based on events in his life. It frustrates me that there are these unknowns.

  6. I’m sure of my birth time! I’m a first child, so everyone was paying attention =) (plus, my mum wrote in in the first page of my baby book… yeah, I’ve got one of those too!)
    It really is THE most frustrating thing, not to have a time. If I’m guestimating, I use 12 noon cause it’s the most recommended & I don’t really have the skills to recon it any other way.
    When I lived in Greece & I’d ask someone of the Grandparent generation when their Birthday was, they’d often respond with “in summer” or “in spring” & that’s about as acurate as it ever got!!! They seem to place more emphasis on Name Days instead.

  7. I have been told I act like I have a Scorpio rising or Aquarius rising. I have been given my time of birth so I have to take that as gospel. I guess I express Cap rising energy differently.

  8. As I’m adopted I don’t have my tob and I have no way of ever finding it out – like several other members of the boards. Being determined to have a working chart, however, I’ve done a lot of rectification, first by trying various times to see where the Asc would fall and which planets would then be in which houses. In time I became convinced I have Virgo Asc and the more I learn, the more sure I’ve become.

    Having settled on that, I then narrowed the time still further by using an emphemeris to plot various important life events with transits, and with my own knowledge of my life and character, I can only say I’m now pretty sure I’ve got it down as accurately as I ever can. The planets sit very happilly n the houses where they seem to function best, and the aspects between them also seem very supportive of my final ‘guesstimate’.

    Because let’s face it, this is still only educated guesswork. I read that there are however some very good software programs now, which will do a rectification using lists of important life events. There are also a few astrologers who specialise in this area who can be found online.

    Statistically far more children are born at night, and especially towards dawn, than during the daytime, so some astrologers use dawn for the place/ time of year, as a putative birth time, rather than noon. I certainly think midnight is better choice than noon, but I’d choose dawn over either.

  9. PS I read Ayn Rand in Italy, where an American girl (an architecture student) who was staying with us, lent me her novels. She revered Rand; I found them utterly chilling and totally fascist in sentiment

  10. I’m very certain–I was the only baby born in the ward and apparently the nurses were all fawning (bored? LOL)

    Plus I was the only baby my mother had, that she was drug-free for. And she is a time-keeper. Yep–positive.

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    Huh. huh-huh-huh. You know Satori, until you posed the question, I don’t think I ever asked myself that question.

    The reason being that in my culture, astrology is TRES important. If for nothing else, it’s used in arranged marriages for horoscope matching.

    But, on further thought, I’m inclined to think it’s quite accurate. My gran’s a Virgo, and my dad’s a Capricorn. The former’s VERY VERY organized, the latter lives life like a chess game. Ya think they’re good record-keepers ;). You better believe they are!

  12. 100% certain as mom wanted me born before midnight, she doesnt know why, but she was watching the clock in the delivery room! So got super accurate chart. Her Jupiter is in my 1st house so thats lucky, she maybe knew without being aware.

  13. I found the piece of paper, where my parents were charting contraction times, during labor (my father had weird confidence in “science,” and believed the hospital team would be helped by that info). ::not, btw::

    How long until someone looked at the wall clock.. That’s always the question. 🙂

  14. I think my mom, a capricorn moon, would give me a nearly accurate estimate. She looked at the clock. My aunt- one scorp moon, hell bent on precision, confirmed it. I am still bugged by my mars on the cusp and on the fact that I can’t see uranus in my 1st and conjunct my rising! Sometimes I think was that clock broken? Maybe it’s because uranus is rx so it almost feels like it would be in my 12th. Makes no sense, neptune and pluto are rx too and I can feel those planets and see them in my behavior. I feel divorced from my uranus. Maybe saturn/lilith in aquarius has to do with restrictions and not really accepting that side in myself? I can’t see it, in what way,why am I not relating to my uranus in 1st??? In body and personality. I look at me and see the moon. Some said that the 1st planet to conjunct the rising by the nearest degree is so There, so blatant that you have trouble seeing it…

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