What about the phenomena or the potential of dragging someone down with you or being dragged down yourself?
It’s a broad topic, I guess. But the scenario that has me thinking of this involves an alcoholic and otherwise addicted woman and a man who is obsessed with her. Love/hate, I guess you could say.
Maybe he wants to save her. She’s not interested. Not even remotely.
The woman is in a downward spiral. She’s got a lot of energy; four planets in Scorpio. She’s in throes of the current transits. Suffice to say, she’s emanating all this energy. Velocity, I guess you could say. It’s to a point where if you stand near her, odds are you’ll be pulled in and go down with her.
This is not intended to denigrate this woman. I have been this woman! I’m just using the story to illustrate what I mean. I don’t really think you can help someone like this, standing above them, though I could be wrong about that. Instead, I’d position myself at a lower level and try to catch her on the way down.
What do you know about scenarios like this? Have you ever been involved in something like this? Or witnessed it? What’s the astrology?
I was married to an alcoholic and tried to save him for 18 years. First, in my defense, growing up, I was not ever around an alcoholic, none in my family, so I had no clue about it. After 3 mos of marriage, I realized something was wrong w him. He hid it very well from me prior to marriage, This started a long string of seeing different therapists for him. After years of therapy it was a very spiritual person that got him to stop…but only for 2 years. He had a Neptune Mars conjunction in the 1st house…classic alcoholic signature. He would go on 2 yr cycles with drinking on/off. He was a Capricorn Sun, so he was a responsible drinker. Only drank after hours and at home, so no dui’s etc. His drinking stemmed from a emotionally and physically abusive father. After I fought this very long battle w him, I just couldn’t do it anymore. His therapist told me to “s__t or get off the pot…that I would need to learn how to live the rest of my life with him, or I was going to leave.” I eventually chose the latter when transiting Pluto crossed (exactly) into my 7th house. I didn’t know about astrology during that time. It would have been helpful.
Welcome, Karen. I hope you’re doing well today.
Karen – you are preaching to the choir! My ex-husband slowly fell into alcoholism and he, too, was a high-functioning drunk. I began addressing his issues when Tr Saturn ingressed into my 7H. In the end, I felt no recourse but to serve him the divorce papers when Tr Saturn was conjunct my Libra Sun and exactly squaring Tr Pluto in Capricorn. The irreconcilable end.
It was years later, after I began studying astrology, that I realized I had to wait for this “perfected timing” for this emotionally-charged event.
In the lines of what Karen and Jayne said, I too was involved with a person with addictions. He has Neptune in Cap in the 1H (just a few degrees ahead of his saturn/uranus conjunction; high functioning/apparently reliable yet volatile and unpredictable. Neptune trines his sun/jupiter conj in the 4H. Exact. Always supported by his mother, that would support his vice if in turn he does what she wants, give her undisputed attention etc. His moon in Antares 12H. Xonj his mothers sun. I have both pluto and saturn in the 7H. Eventually we were fated to meet and split, as our relationship run its course (or curse) for the 3yrs that I had: my saturn return, NN going through natal SN in scorpio and transit of uranus 12h sq pluto in the MC. It was either leave him or lose myself and my reputation with it. Of course the latter didnt come out unscathed and it took my at least another 3 to 5 years to come back to life myself…
For other reasons I went to check the composite between this person and I.
– Composite Neptune square Mars.
-Composite Moon 1H trine Pluto, with… Neptune in their midpoint. – Neptune trine Sun with Moon in the midpoint.
All exact or less than 2deg orb.
I guess one tries to save these people because they seem to be on/off like that. When an addict feels (and they feel it) you are pulling away, they will try and recuperate your trust. It’s a neverebdibg cycle of lies and abuse. And we’re taught to believe that love conquers all, so a person with also a strong venusian/neptunian signature will often believe that patience and sacrifice is what they must endure, if they also have pluto…well, it’s a strong pull tk do so, as its an internal power struggle after a while. You’ve invested so much, it would hurt you not to get the happy ending you struggled for. Takes a lot of strength to stop that downward spiral alright…
I’ve lived through this with family drama since a kid. Alcohol, cultural trauma. I left my family home to outrun it at 25, but the astrology of it is I have a very occupied 8th house and an obsession (Pluto squares my Scorpio) with the addicted family member(s). Life has given me countless episodes to survive: I’ve tried this as you describe from the over it, and from the below it positions. Neither ‘worked’ exactly but I have lived beyond it and know more peace with my place and my ‘right to live.’ My life as a working-at-it-artist and writer channels these energies; one must find that channel to move out of the way and use that energy to create from the fire.
I couldn’t stand too close without being sucked down, out. And time has helped as well as physical distance. I’m not seeking immunity from this ‘karma’ but it does help to transform the harshness and the astrology of that, for me, shows itself in my Progressed Planets in opposition all over the place. Old wisdom comes with having the demon and the angel alternatively being me: human and evolving.
I was a lifeguard as a teenager. We were taught that when someone is drowning, they can start panicking and try to use the lifeguard as their float, pushing them underwater. If the lifeguard finds themselves in this situation, we were instructed to punch the person hard in the nose to hopefully knock them out, and then continue on with the recommended hold to swim both of us to safety.
I come from a disfunctional family, where I am the scapegoat, or the “float”. With my husband’s support, I punched back hard. It was enough to break free but they still have enough codependence amongst each other that they are still flailing. Unfortunately you can’t teach someone to swim if they don’t want to learn, and people don’t always realize they’ve reached the deep end until it’s too late.
It is awful dealing with an alcoholic.
Here’s one that just popped up. He has been in a relationship of sorts with a widow for two years now. They met via Facebook and travelled back and forth to spend time on weekends. While they rarely see each other noe she calls him everyday. He dated someone else in his area for a few months which made her angry. Her husband has been dead three years and she is still stuck there. Talk talk talk about the dead guy and compares him to the dead guy all the time. He is getting dragged down by the dead weight. All I know is that he is a Scorpio and she an Aquarius sun. He is a sympathetic ear I think. But it’s wearing thin.
It reminds me of the woman whose kids I babysat years ago. She was in the restaurant eating alone when I approached her with a nice to see you, how are you. To which she angrily said, ‘how am I supposed to be doing? Hank is dead.’ ‘Oh that’s right’ I responded, I am so sorry for you. How long ago was that anyway?’ ‘4 years ago.’ I said ‘oh’ and left her to sulk into her plate of fish.