Horrible Natal Charts – Terrible Lives

zodiac-plate-vintageHi, Elsa.

Have you read a birth chart that made you think it would be exceedingly difficult for one to positively navigate self and life without given a massive amount of professional guidance; as well as finding the guidance necessary to be difficult to nearly impossible to access?

This begs the question, at least from me, would the latter also be alluded to, or be part of the individual’s birth chart as well?

Thank you, Ms. Elsa.
Columbia, SC

Thanks for the question. I’m not sure I can offer a satisfactory answer but I’m going to try,

I’ve seen many exceedingly difficult charts. It’s never occured to me that I’d be able to discern how hard it would be for someone to find assistance in life.  But let’s just say that did occur to me…

It would be very easy to make a mistake in judging this. You may look at numerous hard aspects and have no doubt the person has had a struggle. But you may miss the Jupiter trines or the way Mars is aspected in their chart.

If you noticed these other things, you might realize that the person with the difficult chart might feel good.  They might thrive via challenge.  My husband is like this. Knock him down, he comes back twice as strong and three times as smart.

It could be that you’re viewing this with a victim mentality. A person faces so much impediment, their life is impossible. That’s more of a “belief” than a fact.  When I see a tremendously difficult chart, I just think the person has been busy. Busy living or busy dying.

You state something is “exceedingly difficult” and “nearly impossible”. That means it can still be done. There is still hope!  So you might conclude that a person with a chart like this has a special ability to do something very few could manage.

Nik Wallenda comes to mind.  Who else can cross the Grand Canyon on a tightrope?

Try this. When you see a difficult chart, assume the person has a special talent.

I don’t like astrology that oppresses a person. “Oh, your life is going to be hard…it’s impossible.”  The fact is, your life is your life. And when ask people if they would trade their life so they might live another person’s life, invariably, they say, “No!”

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28 thoughts on “Horrible Natal Charts – Terrible Lives”

  1. “I don’t like astrology that oppresses a person.” Yes, that`s it. No matter what happens, we all have free will about it. For example I have Moon in Pisces in a square to Neptune, Ascendant, Saturn, Uranus and Chiron. As people say, afflicted Moon, but those squares made me learn some things, and I`m sure that with the attitude I have, things will work out for me in every situation just because I strongly believe they will. Nothing comes easy. First, we seek guidance in others thinking that they will help us, while they lead their own battles. So the greatest help we can get is from us, we are responsible for ourselves.

    1. The fact that events are timed in a chart as well as your ideas of personality astrology showing someone’s personality only state that you do not have any free will at all.
      if there was free will astrology would not exist or be true.
      Think about it a while.

      While this sounds oppressive to many, it is only because of their small minded self-absorption/importance and lack of being able to get beyond their ego.
      It is actually freeing, which is what astrology is really all about. Not personality bs.

      If I can look at a chart and see someone having a car accident, please tell me how they have free will. The extrapolate that.

      Having a client walk in, sit down, and i look at her chart. Knowing what the timing she is in as well as the transits I already see what she is struggling with before she says anything. This repeats almost with every reading.
      Now those stuck with little knowledge believe everything is about personal growth and personality and making everything into some positive due to their lack of being able to cope with what is. Please stop trying to take people’s suffering and spin it into your own beliefs. Lose a child or something and see if your coping belief system doesn’t change. Live thru a holocaust as a jew having your family slaughtered in front of you and then have people throw that same coping belief system on you and see what you then see.

      Question your beliefs
      and even more importantly be respectful of what you put out in the world.

      Acceptance of what is brings contentment and higher qualities. Needing to make up stories for self importance is the opposite direction.

      1. Im sure Im misunderstood. I witnessed domestic violence and alcohol abuse, so yes, my emotions were and are constantly hit from all sides. Afflicted Pisces Moon. But,if I didn`t choose my free will to react to things with understanding, I would have been stuck in the hurt and in the victim mentality.
        And now, after 5 years from my last comment, I`m really glad how I took my own experience to change my life to a more positive one, and create a healthy lifestyle despite the challenges. So yes, free will can do wonders. It depends what you do with the energies. Also , I don`t see how you can tell that someone will have a car accident from the chart. You may assume, because one aspect can present different things. I still say that we are responsible for ourselves. Everyone has a different battle. You can not measure hurt and pain. Its an individual experience. Lets say two people lost their kids. One goes into deep depression, pills, drugs, maybe attempts suicide, the other takes the experience, no matter how painful, and decides to be a support for other people that lost their kids. I hope now you get what I wanted to say.

  2. People with “difficukt charts” are survivors. They do what they have to do and thrive when they gain progress. Those people are who we turn to when our lige become difficult (often) because they know their way around difficulties, since that’s pretty much what they’ve been doing all of their life. Those people are the ones I prefer to sit beside at a dinner table.

    On the opposite, people who have an “easy chart” may not exploit all the options for learning, doing, be self reliant…

  3. I’d also consider the placements and transits of asteroids: (#157) Dejanira – the “victim”; and, both (#26) Perserpina – a.k.a “Mrs. Pluto,” and (#90377) Sedna – not accepting being the victim/rising above dire circumstances utterly transformed.

  4. From my experience and what I’ve seen in others, I know that many “problems” arise when we try to “positively navigate” self and life in a way that doesn’t resonate with who we really are, but just to follow a friend, partner, or a collective trend. And I totally agree with Elsa, exceedingly difficult can be done.

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    I have only known a few really easy charts. Grand trine here and good reception there. They were sweet, nice, happy, and kinda boring.

    Most of the people around me have difficult charts. Myself i have a ton of t squares. Some aspects that are talked of around here as not being fluffy. I see people with difficult charts as interesting… Complex.. Growing and learning… And totally full of the most interesting and entertaining stories.

  6. No aspect is all bad or all good. Its both. You can learn how to deal with the negative aspects in any chart and counter them by using positive traits of that same aspect. I have Venus in Scorpio square Pluto. I should be a vindictive kind of person, but instead I love deeply. I know the energy is there to be a vindictive person, but I don’t indulge it. Other more positive aspects also help to balance that aspect out, like my Sun in Sagittarius.

  7. I have mars square saturn, pluto square venus to begin with. So many squares..c’est la vie… I was just telling my son today how we are not the “teflon” people who get away with all kinds of stuff. We are more the “one toe off the line..busted” type. He’s a cap sun stellium. Thinks I’m crazy because I’m into astrology.

    1. My son was in the anti-astrology camp, for a long time. We want them to have healthy scepticism, right? There are people “predicting” stupid stuff, and calling it astrology.
      My now-grown son told me he now knows, that I did everything I could (and then more) to make my partnership with his dad, work. True, and sweet to know that my son is using his critical brain functions. 🙂

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    I have Venus square Pluto, Mars square Pluto, Mars square Jupiter, Moon opposition Saturn, Pluto square Venus Venus square Uranus and Venus square Saturn. I realize I always have the power of free will to overcome these aspects but my natal chart sucks a fat bullfrog.

  9. Love the Mars comment; knock’em down & comes back twice as strong, 3 times as smart! Know it soooo well. Mars in between Pluto & MC, all conjunct (H10) & sextile Mercury (H8), square to Venus (H7). Mars is my malefic out of sect so I watch it. Mars is relentless, always going rat-a-tat-tat, here I am! Many aaargh moments with Mars. Strong in both good & bad ways. It is how you view it & what you do with it. A favoured mantra; chin up soldier 0:)

    1. Wow, 3 yrs have passed, but still the same message 😉

      Mars is in Taurus & I have been plodding along, but it’s about to go into Gemini (where my natal Venus/Desc is). You bet I have been planning a strategic move for the next part of my ‘working’ life. Those tasks have made me question, knuckle down, plan, listen hard to hear the message & absorb the information. Same mantra is still working 😄

  10. I have a greater understanding of this as I grow older. I have a South Node/Sun with a couple other planets thrown in Virgo. Including Mercury retrograde. Fortunately I also have a Yod to point me to my souls journey. It has never been easy. There has been a lot of pain. Yet I am incredibly resilient. I don’t know any different. I have learned that if I wallow in the past I feel the weight of lifetimes. I keep my eye on the prize. My North node is Pisces. When things get tough I pray for understanding and strength.

  11. Wow, you guys are quite knowledgeable. I have several different astrology books considered by to be among the best (authors included), which were recommended to me by someone of Ms. Elsa’s caliber; someone who also happens to be a contemporary of Ms.Elsa’s. Having said that, I haven’t been able to read and comprehend in a manner lent towards my ability to understand and therefore learn. I believe this may be because I am a visual learner. I have a MA degree, which I only mention to say this is not about intelligence.

    1) I would very much like to learn Astrology from the basics up. Are there any free online courses or specific YouTube videos from a good teacher for the astrologically challenged? I may be intelligent but I am challenged when it comes to learning Astrology by myself☺️.

    2) I need help specifically with what chart meanings of squares, trines, oppositions, conjunctions, sextiles, nodes, t squares (don’t think I’ve heard this one before, but I do feel confused and may not recall just now), and anything else in this category I left out.

    3) In addition, is there a simple answer that can explain retrogrades and what it or they mean. I hope that’s not a complicated one, however when I looked this up online, nothing I read was helpful. I think perhaps I was not looking in the more better?, lol, places.


  12. i like to think my greatest gifts lie in some of my hardest aspects. i’m recently discovering my capacity to transform pain => anger => action is actually a pretty darn useful adaptive tool, for example.

  13. I think my chart absolutely sucks. I have Saturn conjunct the ascendant square my sun and moon in Pisces in the third house. I have been called “utilitarian” for some reason. Growing up, I thought my life was alright, but when I was around 12, my mother, who has an afflicted Saturn in the 5th house in Pisces, started to beat me and put me down all the time. She beat me till I was 16 and ran away from home. I hate my mother, she has always been down on me and negative towards me. I have had extreme problems with depression and anxiety in my life, and very bad acne problems to the point of cystic acne and scarring. I would give anything for nice skin. This has really affected me and made me miserable to the point of wanting to be a hermit. My sun, moon, venus and mercury are all in the third house opposed by Pluto, and Mars is square Pluto, square Venus, and square Mercury. I have had problems with OCD too. I have learned absolutely nothing from life except that I’m generally not liked and prefer to be by myself with my pets, who I love dearly. I remember thinking when I was 11 or 12 that I would have a good life, but it certainly didn’t turn out that way.

    1. I so relate to your post, in al.ost every way except my mother didn’t beat me physically (however, she did verbally). I didn’t run away I became co-dependent with her. I too like being by myself with pets.

  14. My Aquarius-Scorpio 12th/8th chart always got a bit of a reaction from astrologers, including Elsa. But…last week i discovered my true birth time from hospital records, with the result that my birthchart went from having 5 Aquarian planets in the 12th house to NOTHING in the 12th; also Scorpio Moon and Neptune also being relegated from the 8th to the 7th. The resulting lovely feeling is like meeting a twin born two hours later than me, combined with being released from prison. And i have some new astro learning to do too. Matt x

  15. Wow, that is awesome. Please keep us updated.

    I rectified my chart a while back, birth time only went backward by 17 minutes, so essentially the same chart although it ooes move a couple crucial planets off the angles.

  16. Thank you. I’ve been searching the internet for people with “horrible” charts and found your page. I’m an Aries, with Cancer Rising and Mars in Cancer in the Ascendant, Trine Moon in Scorpio and Mercury in Pisces. Saturn is in the 8th house. Mars is square Sun and Opposition Neptune and Uranus. I know that I survived many things in life, but I’m scared that I don’t develop professionally.

  17. I worked very hard but could never obtain success in the home or the world. I have Saturn in the 10th house conjunct the midheaven with Saturn squaring my Aries ascendant. It hurt to learn that people think I’m boring and strange and that success was probably not to come to me, but at least it taught me to stop trying so hard. Also, I have a 12th house Aquarius sun opposing Pluto in Virgo in the 6th. I was emotionally and physically abused at school and by my mother. My family hates me, and I couldn’t figure out why. I now think they have been lying to me about my parentage. I think the woman I thought was my beloved sister was my mother and they all knew it and hated us both for it. I married an abusive man, 7th house Moon conjunct Neptune, and my oldest child abandoned me, the second one is also a possible narcissist and my youngest – the sweet one – was murdered. I thank God for keeping me, but this life is lonely and hard.

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