I like to do this sometimes – talk up some of the signs that are either maligned or overlooked. Libra is one of those signs. You could say Virgo and Libra are like the “flyover states”. Leo attracts attention as so does Scorpio but nobody thinks much about Libra.
I do think manners and fairness and grace are undervalued at the moment and I got into a tirade about it in the comment on the YouTube/Warner Music piece. I just simply don’t like to be around ill-mannered people.
A couple days ago I wrote about boasting while playing (and winning) at cards. I grew up playing cards and this was perfectly acceptable in my family. Matter of fact it was the thing to do but when I got to “town” from the desert, I found out this was ill-mannered.
At first I could not believe it. Playing cards was the one fun thing my family did but I eventually caught on to the fact I was obnoxious and ultimately… well I don’t play cards anymore because it’s just no fun to do in a way that is subdued. I really had to quit because the manners thing killed my game, half of which was based on my ability to banter and I did not like playing in a strait-jacket.
I didn’t like it but I liked offending people even less and as I said a couple days ago, now I write this blog and while it offends people at times, it is not force fed. People come here on a purely voluntary basis, sort of like if I had a card game at my house, you’d be able to talk shit at the table… and I’d talk shit right back.
But on this Libra thing, I really am sickened by poor manners and I am sure I am not the only one. Libra requires some type equilibrium which is why the YouTube things bothers me so much. In short it’s not fair!
In business, both parties should benefit. For example, I am paid for a consultation – I get a benefit and I have got to give that other person a benefit in return. When you try to rake in all the benefits without returning anything (or trying to give as little as possible) to the other party, Libra is disturbed.
Now this may be fashionable (10 for me, 1 for you) but it is not sustainable. It is not good relationship.
The other day I was called a “sucker” for considering the feelings of an ex-lover. I think that’s disturbing too. I just want to say there are people out there who value grace in relationship. I am one of them.
When I was 17 years old I walked into a tiny apartment in my waitress uniform and a man there, the soldier, immediately stood to offer me a chair, the other man sat.
I took that chair, then pulled a cigarette from my pocket. He looked me in the eye and lit that cigarette and had he acted any other way, I seriously doubt we would be here today because guess what? I’m not attracted to uniforms but manners? Tasty, tasty. It’s liking landing in an oasis when you run across them, I really think having them is out of vogue.
Are you well-mannered?
I should add these planets in Aries are triggering the living shit out of my Libra. This is definitely the most challenging Venus retro of my life.
I just feel so compelled to take a stand (Mars!)
::sighs::
I am. And I enjoy good manners immensely. Grew up in a small southern town where some of the older gentlemen had the most exquisite manners. It was long enough ago that everyone did in fact, compared to today.
I work on it. I wish they were better.
I do think they are very important.
Most definitely – early childhood, I went to Catholic School for a few years. If you didn’t have good manners, the Nuns messed you up 🙂 I work with kids every day (public library) – have to say, still to this day, the politest kids are the Catholic School kids. I guess fear is still very motivating.
I was raised by a Southern mother. Manners were sooo important.
In the ’70s Sears had a “charm school.” One of my friends went to it. I wonder if those things exist anymore? Well, obviously not, now that I think about it haha.
I work on my manners all the time…sometimes I fall short, but I’d like to think I’m mostly well-mannered. 🙂
Saturn is exalted in LIBRA. Social “rules”. Good boundaries in relationship…
Relationships SUPPORT you.
My son is a double Libra and innately polite. he’s pretty much mocked for it but one of these days it’s going to get him the girl…
It’s sort of like having curly hair when straight is in vogue or vice versa. These things do turn around.
Jilly – how fascinating about that Sears charm school! I attended cotillion classes, as did many of my friends. My stepson attended something which was called cotillion, but it only lasted one evening, which I find very odd. Mine was ten weeks or so!
Absolutely! Venus in Libra trine Saturn. I like good old-fashioned manners.
not as much as i should. i really need people to tell me “hey, that bugs people, stop it and try this…”
and i still am a bit baffled when someone opens a door for me. it’s sweet, but confusing and i’m not very graceful about it…
I’m well mannered to a point – don’t back me into a corner. I’ve always had a problem just keeping my mouth shut, though. Never did learn when to quit and walk away.
“and i still am a bit baffled when someone opens a door for me. it’s sweet, but confusing and I’m not very graceful about it…”
When someone opens the door for me, I think, thank God, there are still a few of them left…
It is intensely pleasurable and it lasts. I encounter manners like that and I feel good an hour later. Same way I encounter lack of manners and feel bad an hour later.
Classic codependence but so? Libra is no less important than any other sign.
No one expects gemini to date a bore, no do they?
I love manners and always have. I STUDIED etiquette books when I was little and longed for the opportunity to write a condolence note, set a lunch table and wear my hat and gloves to the White House 🙂
I still love writing real letters and thank you notes. Two things I can’t stand in a man: bad table manners and when they use profanity before they know me. I think that is so disrespectful.
When someone was acting rude my Gran used to tell them “you know, manners are free” haha.
Yes I am well mannered and I am outraged when others are rude. I always hold the door as I am passing through it for others behind me. I am always shocked when they don’t say thank’s, like it is expected that the door will be held,lol. I think it is just common courtesy,lol, it isn’t very common is it??? Just like common sense,lol.My Mars is in Libra oppossing my Saturn in Aries.
Yep, my Mars is in Libra and I appreciate good manners, integrity and respect. My Mercury in Cancer tends to make me withdraw from people with too much negativity, extremely rude or horrible manners. I stop speaking, sit back and go into anthropologist mode. LOL
Nope. I am surely not well-mannered in a formal sense. What I am, however, is kind, thoughtful, and full of gratitude. I find that I get by, if only because those qualities embody the spirit of manners anyway.
i have neptune in the 12th house and venus in libra … condescension, rudeness, lack of consideration for the feelings of others… all of the above traits really piss me off.. and even moreso if i see it happening to other people. It seems to make me feel physically ill as well ( which i would attribute to my neptune in 12th.. extremely sensitive to the *vibes* in the environment)… it throws off my inner balance and i need a lot of time on my own to get back up to par.
Elsa, it may comfort you to know that some of us Libras DO like talking smack while we trounce everyone at a game. It’s just that we (I’m told) manage to do so with so much charm that it’s somehow far more palatable from us than it is from the others.
And I suppose it’s true. I wonder all the time why people don’t say, can’t say, won’t speak to things. I tell them how they can do so without slicing someone to bits or inadvertantly setting off their anger … and they tell me that no, I can do that, but they can’t.
I guess I have a way of talking smack and talking straight that conveys my affection and respect for others so that I can do these things without wreaking the havoc of the simply impolite.
Maybe it’s a Mars-Mercury thing you have going on?
I’m generally well mannered, very well mannered.
Recently had a rash, thoughtless moment though…..Sorry again Elsa, I’m so embarrassed.
Thanks, shell.
Libra rising with Mars on asc. I am well mannered, as most would say, to my knowing, but I think sometimes the Leo Sun and Leo Mercury make me a bit too talky, and dominate conversation at times…but Libra always balances that out! It is funny though that I would rather be around someone who is honest and not that polite than to be around someone that is all about propriety, and is a phony.
Treating others with kindness and consideration is something I completely believe in. Just wait ’till Saturn moves into Libra and pretty much forces everyone to pay attention to the “other.” ha! 🙂
Libra Sun, Libra Moon conjunct Neptune here.
I moved from the South to the West Coast and people around here are shocked when I say “excuse me.” (I say it with a nice tone of voice) LOL Pleasantly shocked, I hope, but so astounded that they stop and stare. Sometimes they become very self concious. I think the people on this coast aren’t used to hearing those words in a nice tone.
Amethsyt that reminds me of the time when I said (nicely) “Oh, excuse me” after I bumped into a stranger and he responded with a very snotty and aggressive “Well, sorrrrrrrry!”
He obviously thought I was being passive aggressive. So frigging frustrating!
Well, I bumped into you…so I’m saying excuse me!
I have great manners, which is amazing considering my parents do not. I still remember watching in horror the first time my boyfriend met my parents and when he politely declined a desert, my mum gave it to him anyway…only to have my Dad reach across the table, spear it with his fork and say “Then I’ll eat it.”
Oh, and I live on the wet coast, too.
Sanguine, I get the same kind of thing told to me about somehow being able to say things that others would get punched in the face for saying! I do at times really tick people off though…I also have Venus in Virgo, so I am a perfectionist and want to help others be their hopeful best…I think Libra Mars,on asc. may at times help that too…?
jeez I didn’t even mean to call it ‘wet coast’ (not a fan of puns in general though I seem to be doing them unwittingly these days).
Yes. It’s distracting when people have bad manners. And a guy with great manners always attracts my attention. ::swoon::
“When you try to rake in all the benefits without returning anything (or trying to give as little as possible) to the other party, Libra is disturbed.”
Yeah, it is disturbing. And it never fails to ruin the relationship. Funny, most of these types I’ve met seem to think they’re being clever, or that I’m stupid. I’m shocked at their short-sightedness…and bad manners, yet don’t do anything about it because then it would be rude. Imagine that 😉
I just realized that statement captures my pluto 7th/pluto-venus transit perfectly. I’m annoyingly aware of imbalances/transgressions in relationships, and of course, the bad manners that go with it – and I can’t stand it. Where once I’d make excuses for people and just let bad manners go, now I *have* to have decorum and reciprocation or there is no relationship because I find it too disturbing. It literally leaves me feeling out of balance.
Libra stellium, Saturn in Libra, Venus in 10th opposed Saturn, Capricorn in 7th.
I hope I have manners with four planets in Libra and the moon in capricorn. I do also have mercury conjunct uranus too and I had to really work on my swearing recently! I thought all my f***s were graceful but when a man joked about my foul mouth I didn’t find it very funny.
The two Libras I can immediately think of in my life are neither sufficiently balanced by their good manners.
Both have relatively good manners upfront, but are deceptive and/or “two-faced” to different degrees. One is my brother, another is a person who I allowed to be a friend in my life for too many years because I was too nice. Well, rather, the one who was not my brother has become a much better person, seemingly, but I’m pretty sure some of his manipulative element has remained.
I’m not keen on Virgos, either, but I don’t think that necessarily means “bad people” in this case, just that I’m very incompatible with them.
I’m not a Libra but I believe in general I have very good manners.
Ive got Sun conjunct Saturn in Libra (as well as Jupiter and Pluto in Libra) I feel like the only people I really owe any manners to are old people. Whipersnappers can kiss my ass.
Oh and Bella, I’ve got Scorpio Uranus conjunct Venus in my Third house and despite my stellium in Libra I swear like a sailor too. I can’t help it.
Real life example:
Every Friday I go to a Chinese-English conversation club at a coffee shop. One of the Chinese girls asked me “What does ‘Pussy’ mean?” She said she heard it in the movies and knew it was taboo but wanted to know how and when to say it. So I told her. I gave her a bunch of examples of when people would say “pussy.” I thought I was doing her a service by explaining something in detail, ya know Saturns in Virgo and all, but then my Uranian tendencies started to spark up and I realized I was just listing obscenities. All of a sudden I look up and realize that everyone in the group is staring at me with thier mouths wide open. They all thought my language was quite rude. I put a Libra spin on it and said that in my mind not sharing the associations I had with this supposedly rude word with someone new to our culture would be more rude. One of the Capricorns said to the girl “you’re better off just not saying that word at all.” The Pisces girl looked up from her sketch book and said “It means cat!”
Notatirem, brilliant!
I had SUCH a Libra moment this weekend – it took every ounce of self-control in my body to sit patiently through my drunk friend chewing his meal like a horse! Arrrrgh! I just smiled…
these planets in Aries are triggering the living shit out of my Libra…
I just feel so compelled to take a stand (Mars!)
Thank goodness I have you to map out the experience – I could rewrite this as “I just feel so compelled to be paranoid (Mercury/Pluto)!”
And can I get a ‘what-what’ from my Libra friends here? Nice to see you all!
People with bad manners don’t bother me terribly. Well- unless they’re being incredibly, incredibly rude. All they’re doing is making themselves look bad.
What does bother me is when someone sees me being good mannered and thinks that I’m a snob.
I think the reason why is because Virgo and Libra are the middle children of the zodiac!
Toni – that’s a great point, thank you.
I adore good manners in a man; there is nothing sexier than a real gentleman. I try very hard to mind my own manners, but sometimes I come across more harsh than I intend to (Libra Venus square Cap Saturn w/Moon-Mars in the mix).
Many moons ago, I was daydreaming my way through an inane movie (“Blast from the Past”) when a teensy ‘throwaway’ scene snapped me to attention. It had a deep resonance and this post topic brought it to mind.
(I’m a Libra, a cotillion survivor *and* graduated from the aforementioned Sears charm school ;P –the irony was not lost on me).
Setup: The main character was raised in a fallout shelter by his 60’s era parents. He emerges into modern LA and hilarity ensues (in theory)…two moderns are talking about the guy:
Troy: You know, I asked him about that. He said, good manners are just a way of showing other people we have respect for them. See, I didn’t know that, I thought it was just a way of acting all superior. Oh and you know what else he told me?
Eve: What?
Troy: He thinks I’m a gentleman and you’re a lady.
Eve: [disgusted] Well, consider the source! I don’t even know what a lady is.
Troy: I know, I mean I thought a “gentleman” was somebody that owned horses. But it turns out, his short and simple definition of a lady or a gentleman is, someone who always tries to make sure the people around him or her are as comfortable as possible.
Eve: Where do you think he got all that information?
Troy: From the oddest place – his parents. I mean, I don’t think I got that memo from mine.
I believe in good manners and I was taught it doesn’t cost you anything extra to say please or thank you. I also find that adding I’m sorry to your vocabulary (and meaning it) is a big plus. Btw, for those world travelers learn these phrases in whatever country you are visiting—it really does make a difference.
Justina… let me guess.. you have planets in Aries? AnaBanana, your take on this is my sentiment exactly. I too have pluto 7th house, and 3 planets in Libra… and Venus in Virgo.
I often think that I am well-mannered (venus in libra), but I feel like a bull in a china shop whenever I am around super-Libras. I am always in awe and immensely attracted to manners.