Recently, I was thinking about how people rarely argue anymore. I’ve noticed this since Saturn went into Pisces. It’s too draining?
It is draining, so this seems a reasonable response. Put your own gas mask on, blah, blah, blah. But then I started noticing a downside. This prompted me to start a thread in the forum to discuss the reduction in discourse.
The problem with not interacting is you lose the benefit of interacting. I am talking about the pieces you get from others. There is no doubt, most important things I have ever learned have come via another person in some form. This kind of idea:
This still has not settled inside me. In fact it kicked into a higher gear when some material on “tiny homes” crossed my path. The graphic in the article had many of them pushed together, sort of how bodies are arranged in a graveyard.
Now granted, I am mildly claustrophobic and I have spent most of my life, living in the sticks, but still. People have never enjoyed working in “cubicles”. Living in a compartment must be even worse… but somehow it looks like a “solution” at this time. That’s when it hit me.
The only reason the average person would have to live in a tiny space, would be that they either can’t or won’t or don’t want to get along with other people. You may come to a point where you think this is preferable or even “the only way”. But is it best? You lose the “two heads are better than one”, feature of life and that’s just the start.
Add to this, the idea that “boredom” has a cost. I came across this concept and started another thread. The cost of isolating seems to be stacking up.
I want to throw this up here on the chance someone might seem themselves and want to adjust their sail.
As hard as it is, sometimes, I would not like to end up living alone in a tiny home; never mind dying that way. I also think societal pressure and programming are driving us in this direction; so you may want to resist.
I’m saying, given the option of living and dying in a large coffin (sounds like Pluto in Aquarius, extreme independence) and playing well with others, I’m going with option B.
What do you think?
See I think things are not as crystal clear on this path.
People get hurt, deceived, betrayed and manipulated. That does something to trust way before these last few yrs. It’s always been like that especially for those with good hearts.
You know plants are light green leafed and tender when young but you let them go and those tender leaves grow dark green and bitter. Bitterness is a part of life in my opinion.
Be it alone/or lonely or not – shit happens over a lifetime and people don’t want to trust as much and rightly so. Balance is always in order. Keep to yourself and conserve your energy and choose wisely how and with who it is spent with.
I see your point. I just think this is something to see coming.
I also a person who has someone they trust is far better off than someone who doesn’t. Further, sometimes you just need a friend.
Also, to some extent, people have become convinced dying alone will be easy to deal with. Speaking as someone who works with people in this circumstance, it’s typically deeply painful. Never mind, no one to help or advocate for you.
I think this is like so many other things. The real deal is concealed. You find out when you find out which is often when it’s to late to make a different choice.
I don’t think people are meant to be alone. Just another way to be mislead, but I realize I may be projecting.
Botton line, this is here so people can consider it, if they like.
I agree on every point!
I guess discernment and mindfulness is again as always.
I work in elder care (in home/their’s) and see some of the worst situations happening to loving trusting folks. Elder care is riddled with those installing themselves in elder’s lives to take advantage of them yrs later. People die alone for the most part in our world today be it car accidents, murder, sudden medical issues etc- if one is so lucky and blessed to be held by a loved one’s hand then that’s amazing, but not the norm.
Yes all is to be considered!
I struggle with these thoughts as I am not a social bug by choice NOW (in this world today as of late) but have a solid few + husband etc. I have to and must choose wisely on energy conservation and how it is spent. That is the true universal currency -energy. I do spend time pondering these issues so as to be as comfortable (for lack of better word) as can be with death. I have always seen death where it needs to be seen, felt death when it is near in others and it is part of what’s always been around me but to say one would be comfortable to be alone with it, I guess it takes alot of energy pondering this difficult topic. I will say, I would rather put the effort into that then forge mindless or ‘light’ social contacts.
We are all trying to figure things out and what works best for us, that’s what i love about ElsaELsa 😉 It lays it all out by those that chime in on your posts.
The lack of chiming in is part of what’s driven me to think about all this. Just how depressed are the masses?
I also wonder… there are real people here. Do people prefer something else? I think many do, conscious or otherwise. I’m trying to discern this stuff, so I can maintain or regain, my integrity and authenticity and such.
Writing the stories has also fed this. I know who I am and what I like. I’m trying to rid myself of destructive brainwashing and misdirection. But I do have Libra and venus in the 7th. I really like people and that’s a fact.
I think validation in general is what is lacking and causing low confidence. Whatever was there in our world (validation) and in many of our relationships has been rooted out or aggressively yanked out especially these last few yrs.
Many are fragmented and people are struggling. It takes it’s toll in the confidence sphere to be who you are and participate when doubt, hurt, confusion and anger is present and raw.
Maybe that is in part the reason for lack of chiming. Hope I am understanding correctly and making sense ;-0
I think this is a big part of it and the main reason I wrote this post. It’s for people who are losing their social interaction. I’m trying to mention some things…
There’s a song out there. “You don’t miss your water till you well run dry…”
I personally get a lot from talking to others. Bouncing ideas off then and such. I can easily imagine this being completely eradicated.
Just ask you pal, Alexa! Your pal, Siri! You ai gf!
WE NEED EACHOTHER TO KEEP IT REAL.
With Pluto aspecting so much in my charts, I’m trying to transform myself from non-social and boring TO social and interesting. This includes new social connections – in person.
Maybe Pluto will be helpful to those who are socially autistic?
I think you may always have been non boring- we all are … For me it’s where Mars is and how do we connect it to our 2nd house.
* whom
Probably worth mentioning that many people live with neurodivergence or are intrinsically introverted and need silence/space away from others and a safe place to relax. What looks like a coffin to you might very well be a weighted blanket paradise for someone else. This is often the case with people who are neurotypical and extraverted, they sincerely do not understand that some of us (myself included) shoved into a space with a bunch of other people is disastrous… the sensory overwhelm is bad enough, but my own clairs/empath self cannot tolerate so much of other people’s icky energy, which they would happily exchange with my good energy without my consent. Just wanted you to keep this in mind. Thanks for listening.
Tamara
Good point. Be assured, I am not suggesting one way is best. But I am suggesting there is value in social interaction of some sort. This exchange qualifies.
of course there’s value, I’m not suggesting otherwise, but in my case and in the case of many of my peers, having a little hidey hole after a day of dealing with people face to face is a huge relief. People who prefer solitude (like night owls) are often treated as “less than” in our conformist culture. (I’m not saying you are suggesting this at all.) It’s so hard for people who fit the “norm” to understand that good people exist outside that spectrum too, they just have different needs. Peace✌🏽
I do understand, I have a tiny inner circle. Two of my closet friends, 15 years in one case, 25 in the other, are exactly as you describe.
I’ve written about this somewhere. Neither of them will pick up the phone and call? They both have this in common. I told both of them, not to worry. I’d call them and if they don’t want to pick up, it’d fine.
I have uranus in my 7th. I don’t think I know anyone, not quirky. Why would I? They’d never accept me. I’m not going to conform so it’s how it is, organically.
Have you met my grandfather, who liked to stand on his head in grocery stores, to demonstrate his superior heath, on a vegetarian diet?
I’m not sure I’m as normal as you may think. My grandfather slept on a slanted plywood bed in his front yard, nine months a year. I used to lie in the sun on a wooden picnic table in Colorado. Now I lie right on the deck, I am definitely on your side, if not on your team!
This is also related: https://elsaelsa.com/forum/relationships/camaraderie-at-work
It’s just clearly on my mind. I don’t want to lose my humanity due to social engineering.
Now I see this. https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/ar-BB1ihtdG
Also on topic, I saw a joke about “snooker”. There used to be pool halls and video game arcades, where you could go play or in my case, cruise, lol. These things have been replaced by handheld controllers. Sorry, but there is something to hearts beating in proximity.
Not everyone who lives alone or in a tiny space does so because it is their first or even natural choice. For many in our world, financial or social circumstances sometimes make this the only choice. And maybe, given the alternatives, like a filthy tent in an urban jungle, that dreadful tiny “coffin” looks pretty good. These kind of life “choices” aren’t always what our self absorbed, wound obsessed culture labels them as.
Thank you for saying so. I know too many young, hardworking people who would love to live alone in a tiny house (perhaps with a pet) because it’s something they might actually afford someday. A place to call their own.
I am ft rver..35 ft of peaceful place to retreat
I am an old woman living with an old man in what most would call a tiny home. But what the observing society does not understand is the journey— the reasons and the negotiations that went into living the way we do. 15 years and counting.
This is not an easy option but it honed my discernment genes and together with my husband’s Cancerian Sun heavy Gemini tactics we have survived and slowly root in an unorthodox community where who and what we do is “seen” and appreciated (whoa)
This lifestyle is taxing at the best of times, and then there is winter. On a fixed and tiny income we reach a few very generous friends who share their currencies and the family we do communicate with we go deep, love for real and try to keep learning together in real if not iPhone real fashion.
Chime, chime!
I became a recluse after almost 25 years of being a professional massage therapist/spiritual guide. I used to “see” things a person had experienced while touching them. Serious abuse and dark stuff. I was warned this could happen while in massage school. People came to me sometimes as a last resort since the medical industry wasn’t helping them. I helped a lot of people, and there was a personal cost despite all the ongoing educational training I had. I have a massive skill set, and yet I was burned out from all the pain and suffering I saw, and felt, as a result. Finally, after retiring and having my own thoughts and feelings again, I felt compelled to “get back out there”. My Sagittarius Sun likes people. But sadly, what I often discover, is how superficial people are. I am starved for intellectual stimulation. I’ve considered book clubs until hearing from others about them. Basically reading the same book and eating potluck once a month. Ew! I read nonfiction to gain knowledge, not fiction for entertainment. I tried volunteering at a senior center. The social interactions were astonishingly like being back in high school. Ninety year old’s gossiping about one another was not a good look. Now I volunteer at a local thrift shop that funds the dog and cat shelter. The people I work with are slightly older than me and bring food to share and like having “pajama day” and other strange “group” activities that they obviously did at work somewhere. I just cringe at crap like that. Too serious for my own good? I want adult conversations about ideas and concepts and actions that move things forward, but when I attempt such conversations I get blank stares or people change the topic back to who is having a hip replacement. I spent some time with some 40 somethings for awhile on a cash gig, but found they were still seriously invested in dangerous drug experiences and relationship drama. That was kind of fun for a minute, but soon went south after I asked them if they felt they were really living out their true life purpose. I know, too pointed a question. One of them actually heard me, and still stays in touch, though. But in a general sense, most people I see are struggling to make a living or are on their phone scrolling for relief. An old acquaintance of mine recently said, “Who knew the apocalypse would be so tedious!” and I laughed so hard and long I nearly peed my pants! I laughed because it hurt, honestly. As the veil is pulled aside, what do we discover? About ourselves? About the world we inhabit? I’m frankly disappointed in humanity, in this particular time we are in. I’m disappointed in my self. In that boomer notion that we could change the world. Well, we did and it ain’t pretty. No wonder we get such blow back from younger generations now. “Thanks, Boomer!” So, I agree, Elsa, that being social has a plus side, but my own experience of late is sadly lacking in the juicy stuff. Everyone is in their tiny little bubble hoping not to “get any of that” on them. We’re too soft, like ripe fruit. I wish I had answers for this question. Thanks for putting this out there.
Wow, reading your comment, you’ve seen and experienced a lot of this world and still feel like that in the end. We must be really screwed aren’t we? I really like this quote these days- It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.
Oddly enough, I don’t feel like we are screwed. I think we are being bent into a shape that doesn’t really fit us. Despite my disappointments, I’m in a potent spiritual place. I’ve given up trying to steer the ship. The rudder is out of whack, but I have this underlying sense there is something about to pop that will force the issue. Is this the best we can do, really?? I keep asking family and friends this question in various ways. They rarely have an answer but their actions later kind of prove they heard me on some level. It’s the close in relationships, not the social ones necessarily, at least for me. I”m hearing from family members lately that have largely forgotten I exist. Wanting my input. Other people I’ve known in the past coming out of the woodwork, curious to what’s going on in my life. It’s often occurred to me that part of the issue is that we are over stimulated as a species. The mind fuck, if you’ll pardon the expression, of knowing all too much about all too much, and so much of it we have no way of addressing or affecting on a personal level. We think we can escape the energies of all that chaos by hiding out but can we really? Can we become brave enough to say this out loud to someone, a stranger, a friend? I cannot always contain myself so I’m awkward out there in normie land. At the gas pumps the other day to a fellow gas pumper “Weird times we’re living in lately.” The guy looked at me like I was from another planet, but he nodded his head in agreement “You’ve got that right!” he said, looking nervously back at the gas pump. I felt a wave of compassion wash over me. People are maxed out, go too deep too quickly and they can’t hang. And I don’t know how to do superficial very well. I stay kind to people but take no shit. It’s that Mars Neptune conjunction again. I have just enough heart opening stuff happen to me that life is still worth living, despite my years, the road rash of living in post modern times. We’re not totally screwed. But our sleeve’s on fire. Better put that sucker out and get on with things. There’s a lot of living left to do. Let’s go out and do it with some enthusiasm.
I absolutely agree with you about the social engineering. To own little or nothing and be happy. You seem to see the matter as living in a large coffin or playing well with others. This or that. I’ve lived in apartments and not known or really spoken to my neighbours; our schedules always conflicted and we just never really saw each other, yet this way of living is considered acceptable and normal. Even appealing, to some. The dream/goal I’m currently bringing to fruition will likely see my living in a home made of two 40′ shipping containers. This may seem like the coffin scenario you described. Yet, to me, it seems like absolute freedom and the best of both worlds. My home will be on acres of land, and I will be free to leave it whenever I wish. I have friends and neighbours in the extended community, and will go help them out from time to time, in exchange for food I do not grow or produce myself, or for future assistance on projects as and when needed. I can go to farmers markets, to community events, to the city, and some go to church, I go to a sweat lodge that is always accompanied by a potluck and much socialization. My life is/will be full. Yet, as an introverted/ND/contemplative person, I will have all the time and space I need to walk the land, commune with the trees, the brook, to breathe and write and create to my heart’s content. For me the choice isn’t about isolation or community, but how to customize a blend that works for my needs. To no longer have to force myself into the life I’m told I should be living, and create the life that actually meets my needs. A “tiny-ish home” is part of that picture because of affordability, and the fact that it can be completed rather quickly. It is also efficient to heat with off grid systems. I’ve had enough of paying a corporation to heat my home, experiencing frequent blackouts, and ever rising costs. I can also build another tiny home or two. Maybe rent one out to tourists, maybe have someone who helps me at harvest time or when I have a larger project going live in another. Being forced to do it because the powers that govern our lives teach us we should is one thing, choosing it because it suits us and we want to is quite another. I would never want to do it in a trailer park/campground setting, boxed in with my neighbours, and to me it seems this is the direction society is being pushed, but the problem is not the chosen type of home.
Love this conversation, and the other replies here!
“You seem to see the matter as living in a large coffin or playing well with others. This or that.”
No, I don’t see that. I don’t feel I was understood with this post but I take responsibility for this on every level.
I understand you Elsa, and I have been concerned about the same trend.
The Powers that Be have much to gain by atomizing us into individual units. ” Don’t share, don’t barter, don’t give your advice away for free! Turn to the great Corporation in the sky and we will meet all your needs (for a price).”
Want to resolve a mistake with an Agency? Talk to our computer! Banking issues? Go to our website! Self check out is faster than talking with a human cashier! Maybe it’s just a profit driven decision, but the results are taking a toll on human happiness.
I remember someone pointing out that Evergreen College in Washington State was built during the student protest era of the late 60’s, and it was designed specifically to make it impossible for large groups to gather, and for (police) busses to drive right into the middle of campus if they tried. Once pointed out, I couldn’t “un-see” it.
Unfortunately, Pluto in Aquarius plays right in to this. Aquarius loves convenience and gadgets and isn’t a warm and fuzzy sign.
Thank you and yes. We are on the same wavelength.
There’s a huge difference between interacting with other people when desired, and living with other people. Huge! Love the former, eschew the latter.
You are assuming it will be safe to live alone. For many, this will not be the case.
True. If I was younger I might be gung-ho for the off-grid life, but not in a commune! Other than for the disabled or very infirm elderly in secure institutions, communal living isn’t necessarily safer than a privately secured cubicle, nor necessarily an enduring concept as evidenced in historic examples like Brook Farm, though one CA hippie commune is said to still exist.
Years ago my now-91 year old friend “Rose” took in lodgers who turned out to be abusive, thieving, addicted, mentally ill, even dangerous, not the Golden Girls she’d envisioned.
A farm community or co-op village might work, assuming it’s possible to own or lease enough farmland. Young people buying a commercial property together to convert to studio apartments could work with adequate legal protection for each participant’s investment regardless of inevitable disputes and changes.
The classic Residential Hotel for the young (The Barbizon) or old (like Marigold!), or Rooming Houses with nightly home cooked meals, seem appealing albeit transitional. Could they make a comeback? Perhaps with armed guards for safety!
I attempted to explain myself, here:
https://elsaelsa.com/astrology/ideas-for-the-people-in-a-housing-crisis/
I like Mermaid’s idea for young people to invest in. Old folks will probably need more of the senior retirement communities, both the subsidized and the upscale. But opening your home and heart to strangers, whether in kindness or economy, can be dangerous, as your recliner-thrower shows. It’s certainly possible though to thrive with a B&B approach – exclusive hosting of corporate travelers, graduate students, travel nurses, etc. I’ve known people successful with all of these.
Let me quote Social Psychologist Hugh Mackay author of “The Kindness Revolution.”
“Social isolation has become the No 1 public health problem. We suffer from ‘eye hunger’ when we don’t get enough eye contact every day. We are a social species and at our best when we acknowledge the differences between us and others because we share a common humanity. The survival of the species is dependant not of the fittest, but of the kindest and most co-operative. It’s in our DNA to co-operate and since earliest time, mankind has survived better in friendship circles which nurture us, sustain us and give us that all important sense of belonging.”
I just made a decision in my life that my best friend is upset by. She’s upset because she cares about me and thinks it’s detrimental, and besides that it doesn’t line up with her beliefs. I knew this and braced her for the news, and now she is silent. She’s taking her time and that’s fine. There is no arguing, but we did discuss beforehand.
I hate arguing anymore when I used to love a debate. Everyone takes things so personally, everything seems polarized. I’m hoping my friend and I can get to this new place intact, although I know some things will change. It’s so difficult, and I am always wanting friends.